Songs showing in duplicate in only 1 playlist- some type of iCloud issue/Signing in- I'm lost.

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viper69

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A while back I had to create my playlists all over for some reason, and that's when problems began.

The main issue is with a single playlist- almost all my songs appear in duplicate in my primary smart playlist. Upon inspection I observed the following

  1. The songs in duplicate are songs I have purchased from within iTunes
  2. I went into View>Show View Options and unchecked the iCloud Download
This only removed the blue clouds next to the song files. They remain in duplicate.

The only time the duplicate songs disappear is if I sign out of my Apple account- then the duplicates are removed from the smart play list. When I sign back in, they appear again!

The STRANGE part is that in all my other playlists that I also recreated (they are not smart playlists), the same songs that are duplicated in my main smart list, are NOT, I repeat, are NOT show in duplicate!!!!! This is even more weird.:oops:


I've always remained signed in and never had this happen ever. What's the connection here on this??

Clearly I don't understand Apple, or it's iCloud feature- which I never use to my knowledge.

I'd appreciate any help. I'm stuck, and this is annoying as can be.

Thanks in advance
 

cjmnews

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What are the rules for the smart playlist? Feel free to hide personal information if you want, most likely those rules will not have an impact.
Where is this playlist? iTunes, iPhone?

Standard Playlists have some "rules" as well. Like songs that don't exist can't be added to a standard playlist.

I could guess but more information would make a better answer.
 

viper69

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What are the rules for the smart playlist? Feel free to hide personal information if you want, most likely those rules will not have an impact.
Where is this playlist? iTunes, iPhone?

Standard Playlists have some "rules" as well. Like songs that don't exist can't be added to a standard playlist.

I could guess but more information would make a better answer.
Hi CJ!

Only rule I have is to exclude a certain type of music, eg rock or classical etc

The playlist is on my PC. I’ve never really used my phone for music.
 

cjmnews

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So the rules are:
Match music for the following rules:
Genre is not Classical

If I do that and disable the iCloud Download, then I see no duplicates other than songs that are actually duplicated in my library (same song, same artist, different album). I hate updating the view on every playlist so I add an additional rule:
Location is on this computer​
You may want to do this to prevent the Cloud stuff from showing up.

Have you tried to right click the two copies of a song to see if one of them doesn't exist? You can try playing them and you may get a locate file error for one. This could be a sign that something was altered in your file system, and not in the iTunes Library.
You may want to see if they are in the location you expect. I would also capture the names of a few for testing.

My guess is that you had an iTunes upgrade go bad, and this caused a partial library to be loaded, and you had to recreate your playlists.
If you had a backup of your iTunes Library.itl file from before the "while back" you could replace the current one (keep a backup of the current, just in case) with that (going back in time) though any changes you made between then and now would need to be remade (importing new tracks, altering track data) and you will lose play counts and last played date data from that time until now. See if your old playlists show duplicates. You should play some of the tracks that you noted above to see if they play.

If you are getting a file not found message for the duplicates we can fit that fairly easily.
Create a standard playlist called Good.
Select all tracks in Music, drag it and drop it onto the Good playlist.
Create a smart playlist with the rules:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is Music​
Playlist is not Good​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as Bad

The Bad playlist has all the tracks that the files are missing. These could be the duplicates that you are seeing.
You could create another playlist to show the duplicates:
Create a smart playlist with the rules:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is Good​
Playlist is Bad​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as GoodBadDupes

You should see the same duplicates as your other playlists. Here you can check the duplicates and delete the ones that need the file found.
You can make yet another playlist to do this easier:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is GoodBadDupes​
Playlist is not Good​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as BadDupes

The BadDupes playlist are all the duplicates, select all the tracks, right click one and choose Delete From Library. This will remove the bad duplicates from your library and all the supporting playlists.

Now go back to the Bad playlist and these are the tracks you have to worry about. They are not duplicated with good tracks and actually can't be found. If you have no songs here then you are done. Go to the Clean up section below.

If you still have tracks here, then right click each one and choose Song Info. It should ask you to locate the tracks. Click the Locate button and find the song in your file system. Usually located in C:\Users\<login>\Music\iTunes\iTunes Media\Music\<Artist>\<Album>\<Song Name>.<extension>

You may have to search for the file in Windows Explorer, and get the path there or move it from a weird place to where it should be.
Once you find it, navigate to that location in the Locate window, select the correct file and click on Open.
This should remove the track from the Bad playlist.
If you have songs you don't care about in the Bad playlist, you can always right click them and choose Delete From Library to remove.

Once the Bad playlist is empty you are ready to clean up the mess we made.

Clean up:
Delete the Good playlist
Delete the Bad Playlist
Delete the GoodBadDupes Playlist
Delete the BadDupes Playlist
 

viper69

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So the rules are:
Match music for the following rules:
Genre is not Classical

If I do that and disable the iCloud Download, then I see no duplicates other than songs that are actually duplicated in my library (same song, same artist, different album). I hate updating the view on every playlist so I add an additional rule:
Location is on this computer​
You may want to do this to prevent the Cloud stuff from skhowing up.

Have you tried to right click the two copies of a song to see if one of them doesn't exist? You can try playing them and you may get a locate file error for one. This could be a sign that something was altered in your file system, and not in the iTunes Library.
You may want to see if they are in the location you expect. I would also capture the names of a few for testing.

My guess is that you had an iTunes upgrade go bad, and this caused a partial library to be loaded, and you had to recreate your playlists.
If you had a backup of your iTunes Library.itl file from before the "while back" you could replace the current one (keep a backup of the current, just in case) with that (going back in time) though any changes you made between then and now would need to be remade (importing new tracks, altering track data) and you will lose play counts and last played date data from that time until now. See if your old playlists show duplicates. You should play some of the tracks that you noted above to see if they play.

If you are getting a file not found message for the duplicates we can fit that fairly easily.
Create a standard playlist called Good.
Select all tracks in Music, drag it and drop it onto the Good playlist.
Create a smart playlist with the rules:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is Music​
Playlist is not Good​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as Bad

The Bad playlist has all the tracks that the files are missing. These could be the duplicates that you are seeing.
You could create another playlist to show the duplicates:
Create a smart playlist with the rules:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is Good​
Playlist is Bad​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as GoodBadDupes

You should see the same duplicates as your other playlists. Here you can check the duplicates and delete the ones that need the file found.
You can make yet another playlist to do this easier:
Match music for all of the following rules:​
Playlist is GoodBadDupes​
Playlist is not Good​
Location is on this computer​
Save this playlist as BadDupes

The BadDupes playlist are all the duplicates, select all the tracks, right click one and choose Delete From Library. This will remove the bad duplicates from your library and all the supporting playlists.

Now go back to the Bad playlist and these are the tracks you have to worry about. They are not duplicated with good tracks and actually can't be found. If you have no songs here then you are done. Go to the Clean up section below.

If you still have tracks here, then right click each one and choose Song Info. It should ask you to locate the tracks. Click the Locate button and find the song in your file system. Usually located in C:\Users\<login>\Music\iTunes\iTunes Media\Music\<Artist>\<Album>\<Song Name>.<extension>

You may have to search for the file in Windows Explorer, and get the path there or move it from a weird place to where it should be.
Once you find it, navigate to that location in the Locate window, select the correct file and click on Open.
This should remove the track from the Bad playlist.
If you have songs you don't care about in the Bad playlist, you can always right click them and choose Delete From Library to remove.

Once the Bad playlist is empty you are ready to clean up the mess we made.

Clean up:
Delete the Good playlist
Delete the Bad Playlist
Delete the GoodBadDupes Playlist
Delete the BadDupes Playlist
I will reply later today when by the pc.

I forget the exact single rule I have for my smart list. Basically I have 1,000 files and 30% have the letters ETN associated with them- it’s a radio web station.

So to keep the ETN files out of my Master list I used a single rule to keep them out. Can’t remember if it was Name field or something else- sorry for the confusion.


The songs are all exactly where they should be- I checked. They have never changed location in decades.

But I did check one thing- maybe this helps?

When I’m signed into my Apple account- the duplicates are there. You can play BOTH files.

I right clicked on the music file, and its duplicate that would have the blue iCloud icon next to it.

The actual music files on my HD you can see the selection in the context menu “Show in Windows Explorer” or some verbage that allows you to find the music file.

The DUPLICATE files, upon right clicking on all of them do not have this at all, you can’t find them on my PC, but if you click on iTunes you can play them.

This is all tied into iCloud and the account in some way.

Not sure if I have backups, and I’ll wait for you to read this before I attempt the info you provided

I feel this is some sort of “setting” of something that causes all this.
 

cjmnews

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Since the duplicates are the Cloud version, you just need to use the Location is on this computer to eliminate them.
Add that as a second rule to your playlists.
 

viper69

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Since the duplicates are the Cloud version, you just need to use the Location is on this computer to eliminate them.
Add that as a second rule to your playlists.
CJ

it worked!! Thank you so much, you are always so helpful with your knowledge and TIME. I really appreciate it.

Curious, why does signing out of Apple temporarily remove the iCloud songs from my master smart list?

Do you use iCloud for music? I'm not sure I see the point of using it when one can put songs on the PC in my case, or store songs on their phone...curious to see what you think.

Also what is the significance of the iTunes Library.itl file? Are there other files I should be backing up, other than the playlist files themselves?
 

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Signing out removes the ability to access the cloud. iTunes can't access Apple's copy of the music online unless you are signed in.

No I do not use iCloud Music. In the last 6 years I was on airplanes weekly, and the WiFi there is too slow to stream music, so I want it local on my iPhone, iPad or computer.

iTunes Match:
Sure they upload the tracks they can't match from your library, and upgrade the audio files they can match to a better version and DRM free (a decent way to upgrade the original tracks purchased back in the iTunes 4 days) but you have no control on artwork, if Apple changes versions, you get changed too. You need to make a backup of your personal Music before signing up for the iCloud Library or iTunes Match. Or make sure you downloaded all your tracks to your local computer before turning it off. Skip those 2 steps and you lose a big chunk of your library. Next you can't sync music to your iPhone, iPod or iPad. You MUST stream it, so the iPod is useless now.

Apple Music:
All the downsides of iTunes Match, plus sharing playlists (uh no), and Apple Radio. Not going to happen.

The iTunes Library.itl file has the location of all your music on your hard drive, plus all your playlists, ratings, last played date, date added, all the meta data about your library. I make sure I back it up before every iTunes update. If the update fails, I put the file back in the iTunes folder and try updating again. If it fails again, I put it back and install the previous version of iTunes.

I have my iTunes Library (songs and ITL file) on a RAID 1 pair of drive so if one drive fails, the second drive has an exact copy of the data before the failure. This is also backed up monthly to another drive that I store in a fire box. I have considered an offsite backup, but haven't gotten that paranoid yet. 3 copies is pretty good.
 

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Signing out removes the ability to access the cloud. iTunes can't access Apple's copy of the music online unless you are signed in.

No I do not use iCloud Music. In the last 6 years I was on airplanes weekly, and the WiFi there is too slow to stream music, so I want it local on my iPhone, iPad or computer.

iTunes Match:
Sure they upload the tracks they can't match from your library, and upgrade the audio files they can match to a better version and DRM free (a decent way to upgrade the original tracks purchased back in the iTunes 4 days) but you have no control on artwork, if Apple changes versions, you get changed too. You need to make a backup of your personal Music before signing up for the iCloud Library or iTunes Match. Or make sure you downloaded all your tracks to your local computer before turning it off. Skip those 2 steps and you lose a big chunk of your library. Next you can't sync music to your iPhone, iPod or iPad. You MUST stream it, so the iPod is useless now.

Apple Music:
All the downsides of iTunes Match, plus sharing playlists (uh no), and Apple Radio. Not going to happen.

The iTunes Library.itl file has the location of all your music on your hard drive, plus all your playlists, ratings, last played date, date added, all the meta data about your library. I make sure I back it up before every iTunes update. If the update fails, I put the file back in the iTunes folder and try updating again. If it fails again, I put it back and install the previous version of iTunes.

I have my iTunes Library (songs and ITL file) on a RAID 1 pair of drive so if one drive fails, the second drive has an exact copy of the data before the failure. This is also backed up monthly to another drive that I store in a fire box. I have considered an offsite backup, but haven't gotten that paranoid yet. 3 copies is pretty good.
Wow- how do I make sure I don’t have iTunes Match turned on?

I only use Apple Music on my Sonos system as a “radio”

All the negative things you mentioned about AppleMusic I’m not sure how or when those things would happen?? Those are all negatives for me as well.

Agreed on planes- too slow!! Local only for me

I’ve only backed up my entire My Music directory- would that file be contained in there with some iTunes folder?

Thanks again!
 

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You didn't sign up for iTunes Match ($25/year) or for Apple Music ($10/month, $15/month family, $99/year, student discount) so you don't have these services. You would know if you had these because you have to explicitly sign up for them in the Account menu in iTunes. The negatives of iTunes Match and Apple Music are apparent when you have to pay a fee to Apple or try to sync music to your device and it doesn't work.

Your Sonos is streaming from your iTunes Library it is not using Apple Music.

Yes the iTunes Library.itl file is typically stored in the iTunes folder that is inside the Music folder. You could move it somewhere else, but most users don't know that. If you have iTunes keeping your music organized then it is all under the Music folder and you are getting all of it.
 

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You didn't sign up for iTunes Match ($25/year) or for Apple Music ($10/month, $15/month family, $99/year, student discount) so you don't have these services. You would know if you had these because you have to explicitly sign up for them in the Account menu in iTunes. The negatives of iTunes Match and Apple Music are apparent when you have to pay a fee to Apple or try to sync music to your device and it doesn't work.

Your Sonos is streaming from your iTunes Library it is not using Apple Music.

Yes the iTunes Library.itl file is typically stored in the iTunes folder that is inside the Music folder. You could move it somewhere else, but most users don't know that. If you have iTunes keeping your music organized then it is all under the Music folder and you are getting all of it.
Incorrect - I have Apple Music via my phone provider. I use it a radio.
 

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Sonos can do a direct Apple Music link. You have not enabled it on your iTunes.

You really should stick to streaming directly to the Sonos (until it becomes obsolete).
If you enable Apple Music in iTunes, you lose the ability to sync music to your iPhones, iPads and iPods.

I would rather cancel Apple Music than stop syncing.
 

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Sonos can do a direct Apple Music link. You have not enabled it on your iTunes.

You really should stick to streaming directly to the Sonos (until it becomes obsolete).
If you enable Apple Music in iTunes, you lose the ability to sync music to your iPhones, iPads and iPods.

I would rather cancel Apple Music than stop syncing.
Now I see a bit more- thanks.

I know at times I have used Apple Music in a hotel and streamed music from my phone, as I would with Sonos. I used the Apple Music icon, white with red/blue music note on it.

Does this mean I can’t sync my music from my PC to my phone now????

Why does one lose the ability to sync??

I ask because I was considering putting all my music on my phone, because my small iPod can no longer keep all music I own on it. Don’t always want to use my larger iPod.

I’ve only used iTunes to manipulate my songs on my PC, playlist making, and buying music.

Very basic tasks.

I’ve only used Apple Music on my PC through Sonos.
 

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CJ

A related question maybe here- on my iPhone within the Music, the library has a bunch of songs. Some have a red cloud, a few don’t- what’s the difference? Attached an image below.

I think it means the songs with the red cloud are in Apples server (iCloud)- if so it means I uploaded them all by accident....?

And if true, how come a few songs don’t have the red iCloud symbol?

After reading the above, I don’t want to screw anything up. I feel Apple makes things sound good but the results can be disastrous at times.

I have a feeling I have created a problem without realizing it....thanks again for your time, you’re a real asset.

8354
 

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I believe the songs without the redcloud were perhaps bought “directly” through my phone rather than using iTunes on my PC.

On my phone- Settings>Music looks like the attached.

I can’t upload the shot- it uploads but the screenshot has a line through the file’s file name. Maybe the screenshot is too large in size?

I keep my Show Apple Music slider green, and iCloud music library button is grey
 

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Lots to respond to.

Using the Apple Music app on your iPhone does not stop your iPhone from syncing music. As long as you do not enable it in iTunes, you are fine.
The ability to sync is lost because of the rules for Apple Music prevents syncing. They want to ensure that you use their streaming service. That way they can track the music listened to and some how monetize it.

You should be able to sync music to your iPhone.

Songs with the red cloud are purchased tracks that are not on the iPhone. I ignore these tracks by selecting Downloaded Music first in the Music App before selecting songs, playlist or artist. Songs without the red cloud are downloaded to your iPhone via iTunes or purchased directly.

Leave the iCloud Music off. That is what breaks everything. You can't sync if iCloud Music is enabled.

Yes there are limits to attachment sizes. I use JPG or PNG to compress them. BMP is just too large.
 

viper69

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Lots to respond to.

Using the Apple Music app on your iPhone does not stop your iPhone from syncing music. As long as you do not enable it in iTunes, you are fine.
The ability to sync is lost because of the rules for Apple Music prevents syncing. They want to ensure that you use their streaming service. That way they can track the music listened to and some how monetize it.

You should be able to sync music to your iPhone.

Songs with the red cloud are purchased tracks that are not on the iPhone. I ignore these tracks by selecting Downloaded Music first in the Music App before selecting songs, playlist or artist. Songs without the red cloud are downloaded to your iPhone via iTunes or purchased directly.

Leave the iCloud Music off. That is what breaks everything. You can't sync if iCloud Music is enabled.

Yes there are limits to attachment sizes. I use JPG or PNG to compress them. BMP is just too large.
Thanks CJ!!!

Regarding iCloud music

Does turning it on for a bit, then turning it off still wreck everything- like once you turn it on there’s no going back? Sounds like such a great idea intol you told me how it’s horrible!!! So you’re stuck using streaming it seems. I don’t want that at all!

If I download the red cloud songs to my phone, does this wreck anything too??
 

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When iCloud Music is enabled, music is uploaded to the iCloud Music and you must stream to listen it.
It looks like music is removed from your system as it is uploaded. You will need to download the music again before turning off iCloud Music, or restore your backup after you turn it off.

You can download all the red cloud songs you want. It just uses space on your iPhone.
 

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When iCloud Music is enabled, music is uploaded to the iCloud Music and you must stream to listen it.
It looks like music is removed from your system as it is uploaded. You will need to download the music again before turning off iCloud Music, or restore your backup after you turn it off.

You can download all the red cloud songs you want. It just uses space on your iPhone.
So basically iCloud Music serves as a streaming platform for all your music on all your devices.. but you won’t be able sync and use your devices like you used to. Lame- should be able to do both.

I’ll stay local, and download music to my phone.

And use Apple Music as a radio for streaming radio station when I’m in a hotel

Thanks!
 
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