iPod Classic 1.1.1 released

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papayaninja

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dimmer said:
Papayaninja - thanks for your sensitive advice. You are right. You make the choice of mp3 player, all of which have compromises, and you live with it or change brands. However those of us who have bought iPods since the 2nd generation bought the recent classic with a certain level of expectations based on prior experience. I too can live with the sound defects of the iPod, the bad EQ, the hissing, the clunky and oversimplified interface, and have done so for several years. However when the iPod classic slows my computer to a halt for 10 minutes at a time, when it won't switch off because its hard disk is still spinning or sound still playing (therefore greatly reducing battery length), when its interface has become so slow that it takes longer to enter and leave some screens than the time it takes to switch itself off (or maybe switch itself off) then I think I have some reason to complain that quality control may be absent in a device which I have previously been maybe 80% happy with.

Next time you are right I won't look at new releases of the iPod as being my first choice by default, and will look around for devices that actually work properly in a manner befitting the $400 you pay for this thing. Again thanks for your enlightened contribution to the debate.
You're very welcome. I would sympathize with you if I had any of the problems you claim to have on your unit, but I don't. My computer maybe slows down for 2 seconds when I connect iPod, not unreasonable, and perhaps even an improvement over my photo. I don't have any "sound defects" whatever that is, my iPod sounds the same to me with the crappy headphones I use. Why would you expect your iPod to turn off when sound is playing? That sort of defeats the purpose, don't you think? Unless you're talking about the volume issue again? In that case I'll agree with Jesse and several others in saying that this is why there is a pause button. I also have no issue with the speed, just because of how I use it, but I will give you the fact that it's slower than previous models. It sounds as though your unit is defective, not a result of the firmware.

As for my sensitivity, next time I'll remember to use my kid-gloves when dealing with anybody with different views than myself. Sorry about that. Seeing as your sole post besides the last one in this thread is mocking someone, I think it's interesting that you demean my contribution.

And please, feel free to buy a different player, I'm sure the Creative forums will love your input!
 

ad2326

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i mostly agree with what brendan is saying here. since the 1st gen iPod, it has been the cornerstone of mp3 players. without a doubt. nothing came close in terms of features, simplicity and yadda yadda. i think the ipod will pull through with a couple more updates. theyre going in the right direction.
agreed, the little fella has to do a whole lot more these days to keep up with the times, but it DOES do them. like brendan said, if it didnt play my music then i'd throw it at a wall and buy a Zune or something. if it took my meat and two veg away..... i dont know what i'd do but one step at a time.

i didnt have any real experience of 1.0.3, i upgraded too soon to 1.1 - which is pretty similar to 1.1.1 for me. i never noticed the hissing but from what ive read i never but my ipod in a situation where it would happen, and ive never had the volume down at zero because so far ive used it in the car 99% of the time, in which case i use a line out from the dock connector which means volume bears no burdon.

any road, the thread does seem to have come to more of a debate of "who cares more about the classic's flaws" than "what are the flaws in the first place". MY two cents here is, the two issues we've spent so much time dwelling on here, whether theyre flaws, bugs, features, or sausages, are, lets admit it, minor compared to what the classic DOES do???
it all comes down to how much you, the user, care about them. it depends what youre using your ipod for. when i go into coverflow, yeah, the artwork takes a few seconds to appear, and they edges are a bit jagged to speed it up. doesnt bother me much, because i turned cover flow off in the menu. because its quicker to go into music > albums and scroll quickly so that the letters come up on the screen. and its quicker to search too. when i want to impress my friends i can turn it back on again and watch their jaws drop.
but thats me, for my knowledge every other user might think cover flow is better. so im glad the options there.

the best way to decide is not to sit there and rigourously test the ipods click wheel for sensitivity, and not to sit scrolling the volume to zero and walking into your bedroom, then into the street, and saying "ooh this is far too high, i couldnt sleep with this noise in my ears", and not to turn your ipod into sleep mode over and over until you hear a hiss, and then have a heart attack about it.

the best way to decide is to forget all the problems exist before you go to bed tonight, then when you wake up, use your ipod like YOU want to use it. then, if these flaws come up in everday use, return it, and look for something that suits your lifestyle better.

for mine, the Classic is the best of the bunch. and in my opinion the biggest problems it has right now are the click wheel issues and the sound quality. both of which are on the up but not quite perfect yet. which means theyre going in the right direction, eh??
 

DarthSidious

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i just don't understand how a simple mp3 player firmware can cause a so much troble to Apple. It's just an mp3 player!!!! i don't understand why they don't release some REAL firmware without problems. We are not updating a Microprocesor, we are not updating a computer, it's just a edit mp3 player. All this has to do is Play an mp3 and show me a cover. I think that even Microsoft wouldn't have so much trouble with this.
I'm not a MAC user, but if updating MAC OS is just like this.......

The sad part is that i paid a lot of money and i have to be spending my time complaining about a edit hiss or slow covers and so on. I like my ipod, but this is the last one i buy, i'm tired of apple kidding me like this, sending a firmware update without even telling me what the hell is going to be updated.
I would have bought some $20 mp3 player, and now i would be hearing my songs without any hiss, without any "0 volume" thing, without any scratch sound and all that ####.

One thing i've learned: Ipod is what it is just because a GREAT, HUGE Marketing. It's not so famous because it's a good player.

bye.


Edited to remove profanity. Please read the Forum Policy and do not try to avoid the word filters by word ma5k1ng.
 
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laurenglenn

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The iPod has many features for it that other ones don't: Smart Playlists (#1), Cover Flow (sure, it's cosmetic, but who hasn't shown it off to others?).

Apple's been doing that since I've owned the 5G. That's what iLounge is great for. With every firmware update, some thread is started and people tell others what they've found and thought.

The 0% issue is an inconvenience more than having the whole unit crash. Really 0% is low for bigger headphones. Earbuds, probably not so much, but if they changed it to 1% instead, people would complain that there's no 0. I'd rather have them improve the sound quality, personally.

If the players never advance in functionality, no one would upgrade. If you want a player that just plays music, you can buy a 3G/4G. If you want video and better compatibility, buy a 5G. There's always eBay.

I'd love the iPod to be perfect and well thought of, but it seems that only happens when the next generation comes out. The 5G didn't really sound that great. It was better than the Classic, but not by much. The CreativeLabs players beat it by a mile, but I still kept my iPod because it was easier, had smart playlists, and had more accessories available.

People want what's convenient for them. Many people aren't great with computers (which is why many computers come with all this bloated add-ons that Power Users don't need). More people would buy a device that they can just plug in and set up once without having to keep fiddle with it or run other programs to get it to work. Marketing helps too, but you don't see Creative Labs having great sales despite having lower prices and better sound.
 

rainynight65

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stevehulse said:
The screen saver screen is a design decision by Apple. I don't like it either, but that doesn't make it a bug. The fact that sound can still be heard at zero is probably a design decision too, on the basis that if you want zero sound you just hit pause. Why have no sound and a track still playing??
Quoted for Truth
 

rainynight65

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musichound said:
I think the point that you're both missing is that some people like to be lulled to sleep (not me) by listening to music. At the current volume at 0, this is much too loud.
When I set the volume on my iPod to the lowest level, I can hardly hear anything that resembles music. The ambient sound will be louder at any rate. I still don't understand the complaint.
 

dimmer

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Firstly there is nothing defective about my particular iPod - all of the issues that I have had with it are shared by many many people, and they are real issues that Apple keeps fixing (and for that matter introducing) with firmware updates. And as some have been defects with the iPods basic functionality (for example iPods that remain running despite users thinking they have turned them off - firstly because the hard disk kept spinning, and secondly because the output jacks made a hissing noise) some of us are getting fairly short tempered with those who continue to trivialise us as whiners incapable of using the device properly.

Unluckily there are a lot of us who do not think that the Classic's quality level comes anywhere close to that of the last iPod, whatever your totally satisfactory experience may lead you to conclude about the device. For me (and many others) it has been one issue after another, from an unsatisfactory beginning to newer faults introduced with each firmware update. The reason why many of us stay with Apple is probably a diminishing sense of brand loyalty, but also it isn't that easy to step outside the iPod/iTunes universe once you have invested heavily in it.

I personally have no opinion about the minimum volume level, as it is not an issue that affects me. Therefore I won't criticise those who clearly do think this is an annoying defect. I have clearly stated that as far as I am concerned my classic now works to a satisfactory level, and even the missing game icons which were my biggest remaining annoyance that were clearly a defect rather than a "design feature" (and they were totally trivial in the grand scheme of things beyond another indication of Apple's slipping quality control) have been fixed.
 

TextZombie

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My feeling is that most of the rants I've read about this bug or that feature are all exacerbated by the deafening silence coming from apple and by loss of the kind of control we've come to expect of our gadgets.

We want release notes for firmware upgrades for a start. They know what they changed, we know they changed something, where is the harm in telling those who are interested what the changes were? It gives us a basis for the descision "Should I upgrade to this version?"

Why can't they look at the top 10 issues they are getting feedback about and write a FAQ on their web site? eg "The iPod is a digital device, expecting analogue like volume control on a digital device is unreasonable" or "We know it's an issue a lot of you are concerned about, we're working to resolve it" or "We had to limit the volume in the EU or we wouldn't have been able to sell any iPods there"

I love my classic on the one hand, but it drives me mad on the other. It's the lack of control. On the classic I can choose what music I listen to, what order I listen to it in, the brighness of the screen and the volume (between limits forced on me by apple and the EU) and thats it.

I don't want "Design descisions" made for me, I want to be able to choose what is displayed when my screen nods off, I want to choose what happens when I press the next button when I'm watching a video, I want to choose not to have half my screen devoted to useless eye candy, I want to choose to have coverflow enabled for films instead of/as well as music, I want to choose what order my music is displayed in when I browse it.

From what I read, in the past, those who were frustrated by the lack of control would just erase the firmware and download one made by someone else, someone small enough and interested enough in the opinion of their users, and go away happy; but with the descision to encrypt the firmware of the newer iPods, even that bit of control has been snached away.

Oops I went all ranty and I didn't mean to :D
 

dimmer

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I just want it to work at a very macro level - not to freeze my computer, and to switch off when I want it to, rather than remain running. The rest I can live with. The iPod does both of these things now that Apple has repeatedly repaired the firmware, and therefore I am satisfied enough with it. My satisfaction with the process to get a workable device (presumably until the next update destroys it again) and with Apple is however not high.
 
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freeksngeeks

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Thanks for injecting some sanity into the debate

ad2326 said:
i mostly agree with what brendan is saying here. since the 1st gen iPod, it has been the cornerstone of mp3 players. without a doubt. nothing came close in terms of features, simplicity and yadda yadda. i think the ipod will pull through with a couple more updates. theyre going in the right direction.
agreed, the little fella has to do a whole lot more these days to keep up with the times, but it DOES do them. like brendan said, if it didnt play my music then i'd throw it at a wall and buy a Zune or something. if it took my meat and two veg away..... i dont know what i'd do but one step at a time.

i didnt have any real experience of 1.0.3, i upgraded too soon to 1.1 - which is pretty similar to 1.1.1 for me. i never noticed the hissing but from what ive read i never but my ipod in a situation where it would happen, and ive never had the volume down at zero because so far ive used it in the car 99% of the time, in which case i use a line out from the dock connector which means volume bears no burdon.

any road, the thread does seem to have come to more of a debate of "who cares more about the classic's flaws" than "what are the flaws in the first place". MY two cents here is, the two issues we've spent so much time dwelling on here, whether theyre flaws, bugs, features, or sausages, are, lets admit it, minor compared to what the classic DOES do???
it all comes down to how much you, the user, care about them. it depends what youre using your ipod for. when i go into coverflow, yeah, the artwork takes a few seconds to appear, and they edges are a bit jagged to speed it up. doesnt bother me much, because i turned cover flow off in the menu. because its quicker to go into music > albums and scroll quickly so that the letters come up on the screen. and its quicker to search too. when i want to impress my friends i can turn it back on again and watch their jaws drop.
but thats me, for my knowledge every other user might think cover flow is better. so im glad the options there.

the best way to decide is not to sit there and rigourously test the ipods click wheel for sensitivity, and not to sit scrolling the volume to zero and walking into your bedroom, then into the street, and saying "ooh this is far too high, i couldnt sleep with this noise in my ears", and not to turn your ipod into sleep mode over and over until you hear a hiss, and then have a heart attack about it.

the best way to decide is to forget all the problems exist before you go to bed tonight, then when you wake up, use your ipod like YOU want to use it. then, if these flaws come up in everday use, return it, and look for something that suits your lifestyle better.

for mine, the Classic is the best of the bunch. and in my opinion the biggest problems it has right now are the click wheel issues and the sound quality. both of which are on the up but not quite perfect yet. which means theyre going in the right direction, eh??
I have a Classic 160GB. I travel a lot - a LOT - and I love having my Classic 160 loaded with some 120GB of music and 30+GB of movies/TV programs. I listen/watch it with either earphones (B&O or Sony) or Audi/Technica noise canceling headphones. I LOVE MY CLASSIC!

I am interested in any microcode upgrades that might improve the sound, but meanwhile I am a VERY happy camper indeed.
 

deefadog

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After the upgrade on my 160, the click wheel seems a lot more responsive and the coverflow seems a bit quicker.
 

ad2326

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i agree with the click wheel being a bit better, but i still think that the "eye candy" as it has been called is causing problems with the click wheel.

its like the hard drive is concentrating too hard on loading the floaty artwork and 'forgetting' to respond to user input on the click wheel. which is why i agree, the option to turn off the split screen should be included.

i think while in business terms the customer is always right and there is a lack of information (and action) coming out of apple recently, the phrase 'you can't please everbody' comes to mind, and when that everybody is the bazillions of ipod users out there, i can sort of understand apple's situation.

that said, now that they've put all of these new features into the classic to make it look pretty and satisfy the standard end user, what they need to do is put the option to strip it down, to satisfy us, the people who can talk about it for 9 pages.......!
 

drewhiggins

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If Apple is still releasing updates it shows they are at least taking note. Which is good in a way. Sure, it's never gonna be perfect (what electronics are?) but it's getting there - and I'm pleased to see that.

The sound quality and click wheel might never be perfect for some. But for others, they're happy - it does what it says on the box. Plays music, videos, podcasts, games, photos...
 

borntolose

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how about 'pauses'? clickwheel is much more sensitive but sometimes it just wont respond, for a few seconds. happens to anyone else?
maybe it's the clickwheel protector that came with the marware sportgrip, but i would like to hear from more people.
 

TextZombie

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Clickwheel pauses I've had have seemed down to the eyecandy as ad2623 says, I've had them up to a couple of seconds. This is my first iPod, so I had no real expectations to the responsivness of the interface so the pauses haven't really bothered me.

As to click wheel responsiveness I'm reminded of a sound engineer trick when dealing with picky guitarists. He'd have two sliders marked DFA and DEL on his desk, and when they guy demands more treble or bass or whatever the engineer would adjust these controls until the guitarists was happy. It would only be to the rest of the band that the engineer would confide that these controls were "Does F All" and "Does Even Less". Even if they put out release notes with "- Made clickwheel more responsive" yet did nothing in the software, a third of the userbase would swear it was better, another third would swear it was worse, and the rest would just crack on listening to music without really caring :)
 

ad2326

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haha! that exact situation arose when i was recording with my old band. the engineer was shouting at our guitarist "yeah man its as high as it goes....." through the headphones!

the placebo effect eh!

to be honest though, i think that is half of what this is all about. i sit in my car listening to my classic thinking.... hmm it does sound more tinny i have to say........ but how do i know, i havent got my old 5G to spot test with anymore.


perhaps this whole thread lies somewhere between placebo and propaganda.....
 

rozeqloud

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i do have my 5th gen , and the 6th gen I find is inferior in audio

i spot tested/a-b tested both under identical conditions and found

for lack of a better term , the 6th gen to be tinny in comparison

i ve tested all genres of music from Klaus Schulze to Cannibal Corpse

Weather report to Miles Davis to Marduk. well ya get the point .

Not a knock to anyone elses opinion , its just mine .

No im not a fanboy of any particular product

im hoping this one i dropped several hours of pay on gets better is all

Cheers
 

ad2326

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yep, my initial thoughts were more metallic high end (like when you encode mp3s at too low a bit rate), as well as more predominant treble, and also i think it lacks a bit of punch in the mid range, my music just doesnt sound as powerful as it used to.
its nice to have a second opinion, especially when it matches mine! :)

one thing to remember though is the classic has the new audio converter chip installed. which i guess is almost like plugging new speakers into your hi-fi. its going to sound different, you just have to adjust some settings to put it back. and hopefully thats what apple will be able to do with a few more firmware updates.

and hopefully they will.
and hopefully soon.
 
A

ambin19

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need help!

Just upgraded mine a few minutes ago.

No headphone hiss now. Coverflow appears even faster. Video playlist.

hey were can i download the link for downloading the ipod firmware 1.1.1 please give me the link thanks
 
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