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Topic: Moving iTunes library on a PC with multiple user accounts

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Old 12-18-2010, 02:20 PM
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Moving iTunes library on a PC with multiple user accounts

I'm reasonably familiar with the process, but am not sure how to accomplish this with multiple user accounts.

1) edit/preferences/advanced

2) File/library/organize/consolidate

After I do this on the first user account, do I do the same on other user accounts on the same PC?
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Old 12-18-2010, 09:18 PM
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Need more info from you to be sure, but this is p'bly not going to work. (When you consolidate, files will be moved. If you consolidate for User A it works out great for that user, but now User B's library has worthless paths, since the filepaths that User B's library knows about just got moved for User A.....)

A few questions:
1) What are the circumstances here? Like, is this one computer with several users or users on several computers. If it's one computer, will the users be moving to a machine with a new OS (say, upgrading from XP to 7) or sticking with the same OS? Does each user have her own library, or does everyone share the same library?
2) If this is a single computer with several users, are the media files located on the boot drive or on an external? If multiple computers, how are you sharing the media?

If media files are stored on an external drive/NAS, there's a good chance for success (but not through consolidation); if media files are stored on a boot drive, I'd guesstimate 50/50 odds.....post again with more info.
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Old 12-18-2010, 09:37 PM
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Hi S2_Mac,

This is one computer (Win7/64) with two users, my wife and me. I am rebuilding from a HD crash which required the HD to be replaced. In lieu of another HD, I installed an Intel X25-M 80 GB SSD for OS and programs. My data drive is a 320 GB Samsung (sata) and another 300 GB Seagate (IDE) drive. I have an external esata 1.5 TB drive for backup. I installed iTunes/64 v10.1.0.54. I have a question about that too... but let's take care of one issue at a time.

I don't want the music files on the SSD. I had them on the Samsung before (thank God!) But for several reasons, would like to move them to another file on the same HD. My wife has been the primary user of iTunes. But I just got an iPad (my first Apple device) and it looks like I'm going to need iTunes too (for apps).

Due to the HD crash, I really haven't had time to dive into the iPad yet, so I really don't know anything about it yet. But I get the idea that I have to use iTunes to get apps for it and get firmware updates, etc.

IAC, that's the basic setup for our usage. I have additional wireless networked computers running anything from XP.pro and home to Vista/32. They have separate iTunes libraries for the users.
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Old 12-19-2010, 08:49 AM
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From bottom to top...

You'll be able to make app purchases right from the iPad, but at some point you'll want to sync it to iTunes if for no other reason than backing up your apps. You'll definitely need iTunes for firmware updates or in case the iPad needs to be restored. (Although in my limited experience with 3 iPads, they seem quite robust.)

In your description of The Tragic Events, I'm not seeing anything about your wife's iTunes "library", the listing of music/movies/podcasts/apps/etc. and playlists that the iTunes windows displays. If her library survived -- it's principle component is the "iTunes Library.itl" file located in the "iTunes" folder of her user account's My Music folder -- then yes, you will want to use the Consolidate command to copy music files to a different folder on the Samsung drive. Get the same drive letter assigned to the Samsung drive that it had in the past, reconstruct your wife's user account to the point where you can tell if her iTunes library is intact, then use Consolidate to copy media files to a new location. One note: iTunes really tries to do the least amount of messin' with your files and drives. Because of this, Consolidating doesn't move files from one spot to another; it copies files to the new location and leaves the originals intact. If the Samsung isn't big enough to hold two copies of your media files, you'll have to take a roundabout route: Consolidate to the 1.5TB drive, play a few tracks to prove that everything's OK, then delete the original media files on the Samsung, then Consolidate once more to copy files to the "new" location on the Samsung.)

If your wife's iTunes library didn't survive the crash, she'll have to start from scratch. If this is the case, just move the Samsung files by hand to wherever you want them. If she has playlists on her iPod that she wants to keep, consider spending a few bucks on software to copy stuff from her iPod into iTunes ($15 to $30).

(For mysterious purposes of future-proofing, it will be a big help down the road if you can set up the media-containing folder to be at least one folder away from the drive's root. Like, rather than store media files at E:\\MusicFiles, try to store them at E:\\HouseholdMedia\MediaFiles. Not a show-stopper if you can't/won't, but helpful if you can/will.)

Sounds like you don't have much/any of an iTunes library of your own, so do the consolidating from the wife's user account. For your user account, there's two options: start from scratch, or use a copy of your wife's library as a starter. Post again for the couple of steps needed to use the better half's library as a starter.
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Old 12-19-2010, 01:35 PM
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Interesting comment about the future proofing, Mac.

I'm trying to clean up some of my files and make things a bit more logical, so I was moving the iTunes files from d:\music\itunes to d:\itunes. Sounds like I should have left it alone... but it was buried in a lot of other music files. Also, yes, my wife's music library survived because I had them off the OS drive that failed.

And here's the thing, I didn't post the question until after I'd already done the move on my user account, then I began to consider just what I was supposed to do with my wife's UA. And here we are.

No worries, I have plenty of space on the D:\ drive (Sammy). I haven't deleted the files I copied from yet.

Now that we've established the playing field, let's start again. Should I:
1) create a new folder: d:\itunes\media and move the files to the media folder, then delete the contents of the parent directory (d:\itunes) leaving the media folder with the actual data?
2) then delete the original d:\music\itunes folder which contained the itunes library before I moved it to d:\itunes?
3) and do 1 & 2 from my wife's UA instead of mine.

No, I don't have much of a library myself. I'm happy to use whatever she has in hers, if I can do so. So I'd like to use my wife's library as a starter. I think she's combined our music files anyway.

And before I do any of the above, should I reconcile the following issue? Ever since the fresh install of iTunes/64 on the fresh copy of Win7/64 (and after I'd setup both libraries to the old location (d:\music\itunes), I get the following error every time I crank up iTunes:
Rats, the forum won't let me post an image as a new user. Guess my old UID (long forgotten) won't do me any good.. so I had to register for a new account.

Well, here's the content of the msg:
"The software required for communicating with ipods and mobile phones was not installed correctly. Do you want iTunes to repair this for you? <yes/no>"

I can click yes or no and the msg goes away and iTunes comes up. I can play any file I've tried. I haven't connected her ipod(s) yet, but I did connect my iPad at one point and checked the firmware. If I click yes, I still get the error msg next time I crank up iTunes.

Once I get this resolved, I can move the library as outlined above, and then I do need to investigate how to move her playlists from her iPod. But that will likely be the last item on the agenda.

Thanks for the help!

Last edited by speedlever; 12-19-2010 at 01:40 PM.
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Old 12-19-2010, 05:27 PM
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Since the object sems to be preserving your wife's library, the chief task is to make the music file locations match her iTunes library. That means putting all the music files back where they were; if you don't, her library won't "work."

(The "iTunes library" is a database of info about the music and movie files that a user shows to iTunes. Some of that info is track, album, and artist names; other info is playlist composition, dates and times tracks have been played....all the "metadata" that iTunes makes available to the user. The most important bit of metadata is a music file's location -- its filepath. By recording a track's filepath, the iTunes library knows where to find that file for operations like playback, transfer to an iPod, burning onto a CD, etc. Without that filepath, iTunes can do nothing with a track -- can't play it, can't load it onto an iPod, can't Consolidate it to a new location, etc. So the key thing to making an existing iTunes library work after a crash/rebuild is to make sure the media files are stored in exactly the same folder structure they were in when the computer went belly-up.)

Your job then, is to get those music files back the way they were pre-crash. If you can do that, great! If you can't, then you might as well give up on your wife's library and start everyone from scratch.

If you think you've got that original folder structure restored, give it a try: First, with iTunes quit, make a copy of your wife's "iTunes" folder just for safety (it's at Users/wife/Music/iTunes); doesn't matter where you put it, just so you know where it is. Next, fire up her iTunes and open Preferences->Advanced and set the "iTunes Media folder location" setting to d:\\music\itunes (or whatever it's called) and click OK to save prefs. Now try to Get Info (File menu) on a track in her Music library. If iTunes complains that a file can't be found, you've missed the correct folder structure; quit iTunes, trash the wife's "iTunes" folder, and move the "iTunes" folder copy you made back into place and rename it to "iTunes" if needed; try to get the folder structure of the music files correct, and repeat from the top.

If iTunes didn't complain on that first Get Info, check a few more files from various points in her library. If there are still no complaints, you're reasonably good to go*. Next step is to decide if you really need to consolidate...if so, do it. Quit iTunes. The wife's side of things is now done, but before you leave her user account, make a copy of her "iTunes" folder somewhere that your user account can access.

Now log into your user account. Fire up iTunes and let it get set up -- tell it not to go looking for music files, answer any questions it might have, say thanks -- and then quit iTunes. Now use the copy of her "iTunes" folder to replace the "iTunes" folder in your /Users/speedlever/Music folder; you'll p'bly have to fiddle with the permissions on those files/folders to make them "yours." Launch iTunes again to confirm this; also, check the "iTunes Media folder location" pref on your iTunes. Yer done.



* At the risk of burying you in arcana (too late!) here's the best way to determine the number of missing tracks: Create a new playlist (File->New Playlist); name it "Dead Tracks". Now list your Music library, and select every track in it (Edit->Select All); drag that whole selection onto the icon for the Dead Tracks playlist; let go. Make a note of how many tracks are listed in the Music list (at the very bottom of the iTunes window). Now click on the Dead Tracks playlist icon and note how many tracks are in that playlist. Any difference between the two numbers indicates the number of tracks for which iTunes has an invalid filepath on record; the number of "dead" or "missing" files in your library. You can delete the "Dead Tracks" playlist after comparing the numbers. If you're only missing a few files, you're good! (And if you're missing hundreds...not so good;-)
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Old 12-20-2010, 12:28 AM
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Yowza. I seem to have a gift of making a complicated situation even more complicated.

OK. First off... any idea what the error msg I'm getting about the software not being installed correctly?
Alas, I am handicapped by not being able to post pictures yet. When will that restriction end?

2ndly, just to be clear, I did a move of the files on my user account from their former location to a new location on the same HD (including consolidation).

That being said, I changed nothing (yet) on my wife's UA. If I log onto her UA and crank up iTunes (I get the same error msg posted above), I answer that no and iTunes fires up. Any sample song I select will play and I can get Ctrl-I info. Makes no sense to me as I moved the darn files. Or thought I did.

Here's a shot of her user/name/music/itunes folder:
Argh. No picture posting allowed yet.

Now remember, I moved and consolidated the files from my UA but haven't done so yet on hers. And her file/options/advanced file destination is still set to the old location... which still seems to be working fine. How confusing this is!

And yet I can still play music and get info on the files in her UA even though I moved them from d:\music\itunes to d:\itunes.

I'm gonna have to eat this elephant one bite at a time.
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Old 12-20-2010, 09:06 AM
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The restriction against linking/including images is an anti-spammer measure -- you must registered for at least 7 days and have made at least 10 posts to become a "Regular Member," at which point you can post links and images.

Your wife's library being OK makes sense; IIRC, your initial "move" of the files on d: was actually a "copy" of those files; the originals were still where iTunes expected them to be.

The error is hard to definitively pin down, but it's p'bly UAC or A-V preventing iTunes from installing a couple of USB drivers. I would try this first:
1) Turn off UAC (type "UAC" into Start Menu or Control Panel search box; click the "Change user account control settings" link; in the box that opens drag the slider all the way down and click OK button); turn off anti-virus. I think a reboot is not required, but it can't hurt....
2) Try iTunes -- when you get the error, click the Repair button...it might just work. Relaunch iTunes just to be sure....
3) If no joy, quit iTunes ::insert sarcasm here:: and either completely uninstall iTunes then reinstall or, if you're handy with this stuff, try the by-hand repair in this Apple Discussions post (it's the last post in the thread).
4) Turn UAC and anti-virus back on.
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Old 12-20-2010, 10:21 AM
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Thanks Mac.

First things first. I'll try to get rid of that error. Then maybe I can get to an understanding of how I could move the library on my account and yet my wife's UA still shows the library in the old location. Right now it sounds like I have two complete copies in different locations. But I suspect changes made to one will not be reflected in the other. Anyway, more on that later. Let me take care of some housekeeping first.

'Preciate the info on the anti-spam issue. Makes sense.
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Old 12-20-2010, 10:26 PM
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Alrighty Mac. I finally had some time to work on iTunes. Looks like success getting rid of that error. Here's what I did.

My wife wanted to try her iTunes out, so we switched users and launched iTunes on her UA. Got the usual error msg as above. I chose to repair it and my wife worked for a while on her library. She found that some of her purchases are not showing.. and that iTunes doesn't recognize that she's bought them before (not grayed out).

I logged off her account and went back into my UA. I turned off UAC, and disabled AntiVir guard. I cranked up iTunes and voila!.. no error msg. Hmm. So I turned UAC back on, enabled AntiVir guard, and rebooted. iTunes cranks up with no errors. Switched to my wife's UA and iTunes also cranks up with no errors.

Interesting. Perhaps doing the repair on her UA might have fixed iTunes. I dunno.

So now here we are. Should I move the library back to where I started from on my UA before I moved it? And delete the copy left over in the current folder? I also hopefully have a good copy of the library on my external backup drive as another option. But I wonder if she would get her missing music back if I move the library back where it was originally?
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Old 12-21-2010, 09:35 AM
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The first thing you should do is not move any more files around ;-)

The second thing you should do is authorize your wife's iTunes to play back purchased tracks -- iTunes Store menu->"Authorize this computer"; enter iTunes Store ID and password.

Now if I'm not mistaken, the better half has most of her music working, yes? How many tracks are "missing"? (As in iTunes can't locate the files, detailed in an earlier response.) If it's less than 15% or so, you might want to just call this a win and let it go....

If she's missing tons of stuff then adding files from the copies you made is p'bly better than moving files/folders around on your own. To get a list of what tracks are "missing" their files, do this:
1) As in an earlier post, create a regular playlist named "Dead Tracks"; with her Music list displayed, Select All and then drag that whole mass onto the Dead Tracks playlist icon; let go.
2) File menu->New Smart Playlist; when the smart list box opens select "Playlist" from the popup on the left, set the center popup to "is", and select "Music" from the popup on the right. Next, click the + sign button and fill in the new line that appears with "Playlist" "is not" "Dead Tracks"; click OK.

This smart playlist now lists every track for which iTunes can't find a file. Based on the artist, album, and track names you should be able to track these files down. Making sure her iTunes Prefs->Advanced->"Copy files to iTunes Media folder when adding to library" is checked and saved, drop files onto the Music playlist icon.

When you're satisified with her library, follow the previous instructions for copying her library into your UA, or post again for more details....

Oops, almost forgot -- Glad the error went away!
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Old 12-21-2010, 11:36 AM
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Ok. But I feel out of sorts with the library (at least on my UA) moved to a different location than her UA iTunes location specifies. At some point, I want to dump all the duplicates and copies. While I have plenty of space on the HD (for now), that won't always be true.

I don't know how many she's missing. At least one and likely more.

I'll have to work through that dead playlist routine and see what shows up. Back later when I have more info.

Many thanks for your help.
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Old 12-21-2010, 03:58 PM
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Mac,

I copied the iTunes folder from both our UAs to my d:\ drive.
Her itunes: 64.7 MB
My itunes: 63.2 MB

I created the Dead tracks playlist.
Library Music shows 3095 items
Dead tracks playlist shows 3095 items

I created the smart playlist per your instructions, and it is empty.

What do you think?

(I'm still itching to move my UA itunes library back to the same location as her itunes point to.. or at least get them in one location somehow or other).

Here's some more boring info:
External drive (backup) \music\itunes: 14.0 GB.5426 files.1679 folders
D:\music\itunes (original location): 14.0 GB.5427 files.2332 folders
D:\itunes (new location on my UA): 13.9 GB.3100 files.1718 folders

Edit: I have not yet copied her \user\name\mymusic\itunes folder to my UA.

Edit2: I just asked my wife about the missing song that she knows of. I used Search Everything and found it here:
d:\itunes media\music\<artist>\<album> (and also in my external drive backup also under \itunes media\music.

I brought it up in WMP and it plays. Now how about that.

I must say that my brain is truly scrambled as to where in the heck itunes stores music files. I'll probably have to be told several times before it finally sticks in my head.

Last edited by speedlever; 12-21-2010 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 12-21-2010, 07:31 PM
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I created the Dead tracks playlist. Library Music shows 3095 items. Dead tracks playlist shows 3095 items. I created the smart playlist per your instructions, and it is empty.

If "Dead Tracks" shows the same number of tracks as her Music listing, then none are "missing"; this is confirmed by the smart playlist. She should be able to play all her tracks. Sounds to me like there's no problem.... (Files with an incorrect filepath would not have made it into the Dead Tracks playlist; if there were files with bad paths listed in the library, the Dead Track playlist's count would have been less than the Music listing's count. The smart playlist is just a way of generating a list of the tracks that didn't make it into Dead Tracks.)

Here's the iTunes system:
There are two main aspects to an iTunes install -- the library and the music collection. The "Library" is a database of info about the music files; it includes info such as name, artist, and album; also, which playlists the files belong to, how many times the files have been played, the ratings assigned to the files by the user, and (important to this discussion) the location of those files -- the precise path of folders and file name and file extension for each file. The location info is needed for iTunes to be able to play the files, copy the files, move the files, add the files to playlists, make changes to the files' tag info...in short, the filepaths are the key to being able to do just about anything with the files. The music collection is the actual files.

It's very much like a traditional book library -- you've got the card catalog, and the actual books. The card catalog (analogous to the iTunes "library") contains info about the books: title, author, date published, genre, etc....and a shelf location (each book's "file path") so that library users and librarians can find the books they're interested in. When a book's catalog entry is wrong, or when a book has been misfiled on the shelves, chaos ensues -- the only way to find the "missing" book is to crawl through the shelves until it's found. Ouch.

The iTunes program's default preferences are set up to store the music collection in the same folder as the library -- in the "iTunes" folder in the user account's "Music" (or "My Music") folder. This puts everything in one neat bundle, making it really easy to move to another computer or perform a backup. This system also allows iTunes to "manage" your files -- to adjust the folder structure and file names to reflect changes you make to data about those files. It's literally a set-and-forget system -- add your files to the library, and iTunes will handle everything else. (Again similar to a book library; you just bring your books to the counter, and the librarians handle the actual cataloging and filing.) These are the iTunes Prefs->Advanced->"Copy files to iTunes Media folder when adding to library" and "Keep iTunes Media folder organized" settings.

There are variants to this -- not letting iTunes handle the filing or organizing -- but they aren't worth discussing. (Certain iconoclasts insist that only they can properly file their music, or that certain genres belong here while others belong there...these folks almost invariably get bit in the butt when it comes time to back up their files or move their installation to another computer; ignore 'em.)

Now, for someone like me (10,000+ lossless tracks) or you (accessing one set of files by multiple users, and also not wanting to use precious SSD space on mere music files), storing music files in a single user's account on the boot drive just isn't practical. So iTunes lets us decide where those files will be stored; this is the iTunes Prefs->Advanced->"iTunes Media folder location" setting. For both you and I, this pref is set to a folder on an external hard drive. (No book library analogy here; sorry ;-) As long as we keep the "Copy files to iTunes Media..." and "Keep iTunes Media organized" prefs checked, iTunes will handle all the drudgery for us, without fail. The only real "trick" to this is remembering to let "Consolidate Library" take care of moving our music collections to other locations, and to otherwise keep our grubby mitts off our music files ;-)

There are two ways to find out where iTunes has filed your music. First, you can Get Info for a track and see the file's path in the Summary pane of the Get Info box. Or, right-click on a track and choose the "Reveal in Explorer" command from the popup menu (or just select a track and press Ctrl-R to reveal in Explorer). If you want to copy a few tracks, just select them in the iTunes window and then drop them onto a destination like a folder or thumb drive; iTunes will copy them right over. To delete files, just select them in the iTunes window and press Shift-Delete; iTunes will remove the track(s) listing from your library and move the file(s) to the Recycle Bin. The whole system is designed to make file location trivially unimportant to the user...as long as the user lets iTunes do its job.

So you can easily determine where iTunes is storing your files. To absoposilutely know that your files are in the "right place," just do a Consolidate (but I don't think it's needed):
1) Make sure your "iTunes Media folder location" is correct; in your case I think this is the d:\\music\itunes folder. For ultimate safety, quit iTunes and save a copy of your wife's Users/name/Music/iTunes folder somewhere;
2) If you quit iTunes to copy the iTunes folder, re-launch it. Choose the File menu->Library->Organize Library command, click on the "Consolidate Library" radio button, and click OK. iTunes will make sure that every file accurately listed in the library will be copied into the folder you've designated as the iTunes Media folder (d:\\music\itunes). Files won't be duped; only files that are living somewhere else will be added to the designated iTunes Media folder. Everything will be neatly organized. Select a playlist or just a few random tracks -- everything should play just fine. You can double-check that iTunes has done the right thing by Ctrl-I on a selected track for its Info box, or Ctrl-R to see the file in Explorer.

When you're satisfied that everything is as it should be, you can trash the wife's UA's "iTunes" folder backup and the entire d:\\itunes folder that you made at the start of this adventure. (After this housecleaning, now would be a great time to make a copy of the wife's iTunes folder and the d:\\music\itunes folder onto the 1.5TB drive, or any drive other than c: or d

Anticipating a question from you: The current folder names on the d: drive -- d:\\music and d:\\music\itunes -- are fine; no need to change them. Yes, I specified d:\\iTunes\iTunes Media, but the key thing is to have the music-containing folder two levels deep on the hard drive; you're good to go.
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Old 12-21-2010, 08:39 PM
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Mac,

That is just excellent information. I'm gonna print it so I can read it again and again.. in hopes it will actually sink into my brain. (my brain does hurt right now!)

Can you tell my why that one missing song was found in \itunes\media but doesn't show in the itunes library?

I don't think I saw that mentioned in the epistle above. But I need to read it a few times to get the gist of it.

Back later.

And many thanks for your efforts to help me.

Last edited by speedlever; 12-22-2010 at 05:44 AM.
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