Bookmarking Non-Audible Files: Success!! [Archive]

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Stensvaag

03-19-2004, 01:27 PM

I am a huge fan of audible.com and have listened to many books. Some spectacular books are not available from audible.com, however, and are worth obtaining from places like booksontape.com. A good example is Nelson Mandela's Autobiography, Long Walk to Freedom (28 glorious hours).

I have been using a program called PolderBitS Sound Recorder to stream the audio from an audiotape player into my PC and into WAV and eventually MP3 files. It takes a bit of time to make the MP3 files, but the freedom of having complete audio-tape books on the iPod is worth it. The program is available at www.polderbits.com and I highly recommend it. (I had to pay $44, including postage both ways to get a 30-day rental of Long Walk to Freedom, but it was worth every penny. I next plan to get #### Estell reading Carl Sandburg's multi-volume biography of Abraham Lincoln and turn that into iPod files.)

I've learned the trick of making AAC files bookmarkable, by renaming the extent to *.M4B. It works like a charm. Unfortunately, this can only be done with AAC files, not MP3 files, as far as I can tell. To make the Long Walk to Freedom MP3 files bookmarkable, I had iTunes convert the MP3 files to AAC files and then rename them. True, I lost a little bit of audio quality in this conversion process, but in an audio book, the loss is imperceptible to me.

Here's my question: Does anyone know of a program that will take audiotape input (like polderbits) and immediately convert it to AAC files, rather than MP3 files, so that I can skip this step?

Thanks!

arsolot

03-19-2004, 02:17 PM

Do I understand that if one changes the the .aac file extension to .m4b, then the file can be "bookmarked"? Does this mean that the book is divided into segments, or just that one's place is saved for the next time you listen to the book? What is a ".m4b" file?

Stensvaag

03-19-2004, 02:26 PM

Originally posted by arsolot
Do I understand that if one changes the the .aac file extension to .m4b, then the file can be "bookmarked"? Does this mean that the book is divided into sections, or just that one's place is saved for the next time you listen to the book? What is a ".m4b" file?

Go here for instructions on how to achieve this "bookmark magic."

http://www.ipodlounge.com/articles_more.php?id=3233_0_8_0_C

You don't need an AppleScript if you are on a PC. Just rename your *.M4P files to *.M4B. Technically, according to the article, you need to have a space after the M4B, but when I rename these in DOS (which does't seem to let me do that) and re-add them to the library (you have to delete the old files from the library first) they become bookmarkable in the sense that they remember the place where you left off. This magic does not divide the book into sections, but resuming where you left off is a great feature.

dordale

03-20-2004, 05:39 AM

Stensvaag--

--Using Windows XP--

If I understand you correctly, all you are doing is changing the file extension from .M4P to .M4B and after this you have files that are bookmarkable.

I tried this--and indeed when my file is in itunes, it remembers where it last was when I go back to it. But--files with .m4b extensions that I've transferred to my iPod don't "bookmark".

Have you been able to get this to work with files on your iPod, or only in iTunes?

Thanks--I'd really love to have bookmarkable files on my iPod and appreciate any input in getting them that way.

dordale :)

Stensvaag

03-20-2004, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by dordale
Stensvaag--

I tried this--and indeed when my file is in itunes, it remembers where it last was when I go back to it. But--files with .m4b extensions that I've transferred to my iPod don't "bookmark".

Have you been able to get this to work with files on your iPod, or only in iTunes?

I haven't tried playing them in iTunes itself and resuming. All of my tests have been in the iPod and, yes, each of the renamed files remembers where I left off. I am in the Win2K world, but I would be amazed if that made any different. I do have a 3G iPod, though. I wonder if you may have an older model.

The only other thing I can think of is that the original posting says that there must be a space after the M4B in the file extent. I keep trying to do that on the PC side (and have maybe been more successful than I can tell by checking the file name on the PC).

It's odd, though. If it is working in iTunes for you, I would think it would work on the iPod, as it does for me.

Have you considered trying to ask the person who originally posted the message about this Bookmark Magic?

Good luck!

dordale

03-20-2004, 01:45 PM

Stensvaag--

Thanks for the reply...It doesn't sound like the original poster knows much about doing this on the windows platform--see the discussion here: http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23217

I do have a 3g iPod, although I'm still running firmware 2.01 on it. I will try updating my firmware to version 2.1 and see if this might help.

Like you, I also tried putting the space at the end of the file name ".m4b " but windows just seems to ignore it.

I'm very hopeful about getting this to work, since you're able to get it to work on your iPod.--I'll keep trying. Also, I do think it's interesting that it works perfectly in iTunes for me, but the iPod just seems to ignore the bookmarks.

I'll post back with my results.

dordale :)

Stensvaag

03-20-2004, 02:08 PM

Originally posted by dordale
Like you, I also tried putting the space at the end of the file name ".m4b " but windows just seems to ignore it.

This is almost certainly not the explanation, but are you using upper case for the file extent? I force my file name to *.M4B. That would be majorly weird if it makes a difference, but perhaps the iPod doesn't see it correctly unless it is in upper case?

Thanks for the link to the other thread. I didn't know about it!

dordale

03-20-2004, 03:38 PM

Success!!!

Thanks for your help Stensvaag!

I updated my iPod firmware to version 2.1--and now files aac files with the m4b extension are bookmarkable!! :D :D

To be truthful, I don't know if the update was necessary--after I updated my firmware, I looked at the files on my iPod, and both versions of my test files were there (the original mp3 files and the newly converted m4b files). Prior to updating, I *know* I deleted the files from the Ipod and I could no longer see them when I accessed my iPod through iTunes. But, after I updated, and looked at the contents on my iPod, it listed both file versions, so apparently the original delete didn't quite take. I really don't know if I was playing the old mp3 files when I was testing my iPod or the new m4b files.

I redeleted the mp3 files--noticing increased memory space on the iPod, so now knew they were indeed deleted. The new m4b files bookmark just like audible files.

BTW, I am using lower case for the mb4 extension, so apparently it doesn't matter whether that's upper or lower case.

I am a happy camper :)
dordale

Stensvaag

03-20-2004, 04:16 PM

Originally posted by dordale
Success!!!

I looked at the files on my iPod, and both versions of my test files were there (the original mp3 files and the newly converted m4b files). Prior to updating, I *know* I deleted the files from the Ipod and I could no longer see them when I accessed my iPod through iTunes. But, after I updated, and looked at the contents on my iPod, it listed both file versions, so apparently the original delete didn't quite take. I really don't know if I was playing the old mp3 files when I was testing my iPod or the new m4b files.

I redeleted the mp3 files--noticing increased memory space on the iPod, so now knew they were indeed deleted. The new m4b files bookmark just like audible files.

Terrific! I hope that many readers will stumble across this thread and learn from our examples that it IS now possible to have bookmarkable AAC files on Win-based iPods. I agree that it is confusing keeping track of which version is which, once you do this file renaming stuff. It is a good idea to delete the files from the Library (watching the total free space go up to confirm actual deletion) and to re-add the correct files to the Library.

Happy iPoding to you . . .

robert

03-21-2004, 01:25 AM

__________________________________________________
Edit 5-25-04. For a vastly improved solution go to

Complete Beginner?s Guide for Copying Audio CD?s into a Bookmarking iTunes/iPod file (http://ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=201254#post201254)

I vastly pefer this solution which avoids the MP3 merge and the time consuming, computer hogging AAC conversion. This alternative solution creates a bookmarkable file for each cd, and uses a Smartlist and numbering convention to flow smoothy and automatically from one cd file to the next, removing listened-to files from the smart list.

Many thanks to the help of members of this forum.
__________________________________________________

Rips, copies, or creates a complete audio book set of CD?s into a single ?song? (file, book) which retains bookmarks in iTunes and on iPod.

Warning: bookmark in these files is lost when you sync your iPod with iTunes. Before sync or auto sync, note audio book time elasped on iPod. After synch, tap center of iPod wheel until time bar appears. Spin wheel rapidly either direction to get to time previously noted. When unused, leave iPod plugged into either computer or charger to avoid > 24 hour bookmark loss.

Use this process only to copy CD?s in your possession that you own or have on loan from a library.

The Following step-by-step 5-23-04 extensive post update reflects subsequent suggestions. Particular thanks to Stensvaag (for original conversion concept, lots of help, and graying out solution), gshipley (for mp3 merge freeware) and GearHead (for vastly simplified single-step join cd tracks before ripping):
_______________________________________________

I. Rip or copy the audio CD?s into iTunes into a single mp3 file for each CD. Many thanks to GearHead for simplified and unified solution
1. Open iTunes, and Click on the top menu Edit > Preferences and click on the "Importing" Tab and select ?mp3 encoding?
2. Insert CD>and, in iTunes Source Column, click on Audio CD to display the CD tracks. Alternatively, click on ?use iTunes to import? it that window appears. CD will not appear instantaneously in iTunes Source column.
3. Highlight all the tracks of the CD. (Click on first track, then hold shift while clicking on the last track).
4. Right click highlighted tracks, click yes to change all, Right Click>select ?Get Info.? In resulting window: validate or type in ?Artist? (Author), ?Album? (Book Name), ?Genre? (Audiobook), and ?Disc? (Disc X of Y -- checking ?OF?). Update the disc number for subsequent CD?s). Do not check ?part of compilation.? Disc identification is crucial for subsequent sorting and identification. ?
5. With all tracks still highlighted, click on ?Advanced?>Join Tracks. Result should be a single bracket around all the tracks, a checked square to left of bracket on first track line. If ?Join Tracks? is grayed out: 1. All tracks must be selected/highlighted (see 3 above) and/or 2. click on left-most column until re-ordered into 1, 2, 3, etc., sequence -- even if tracks are already in sequence. Many thanks to Stensvaag for grayed-out solution ! If you forget to join tracks do it over, checking replace.
6. Click on ?Import? button (upper right of window). Upon completion of import, the individual CD?s will be in iTunes Library. Click Date Added column until you see at top.
Repeat steps 2-6 for each CD of the book.
==================================================
General Information Which May be Helpful

One-time, download the freeware MP3 Merger. [Required only if you want one iTunes/iPod file for the book.] Special thanks to gshipley for introducing this freeware to the forum.

1. Open http://mp3merge.netfirms.com/ and click on Download MP3 Merger link
2. Open the file (or save it to your computer)
3. Somewhere in this down load process is the option to put Download MP3 Merger on your desktop. Do it so that it is easily found.
To locate a newly created file in iTunes
In iTunes Click on Library in Source, click on Browse button upper right, until Genre/Artist/Album do not show above song listing. Click on ?date added? column heading to sort it until latest date is first and file is on top of list. It may be necessary to Left click on Date Added column a few times to get newly added file on top.
***Locating iTunes Folder or files
Default is C:\Documents and Settings\Default\My Documents\My Music\iTunes\iTunes Music\Book Name or Author name and not necessarily in alphabetical order.
Go to iTunes/Edit/Preferences/Advanced Tab/iTunes Music Folder to determine or verify the location of your iTunes Music Folder location.
It may be necessary to click a couple of times on date added column heading in iTunes to get a newly created file to show up.
An erroneously deleted file may be restored from recycle bin with a right click/restore.
To add/remove a needed/no-longer-needed column in iTunes listings
Right Click on any column heading/click on checked item to remove column, click on unchecked items to add that column. Successive Clicking on any column heading will sort that column.
Time management ? plan to optimize your use of time during this process
Ripping CD?s, Section I, requires only occasional insertion of CD?s and validating information. This can easily be done while you are doing other things on your computer ? listening to the book or engaging in other computer tasks. However, the conversion to AAC files, Section III, will engage a lot of computer resources for ten minutes+ per CD -- perhaps plan to leave your computer converting to AAC while you sleep or eat.
--
Alternatively, eliminate AAC conversion step by ripping joined tracks AAC Encoder and create one iPod iTunes file for each audio CD. (Before ripping, in iTunes, click on the top menu Edit > Preferences and click on the "Importing" Tab and select ?AAC Encoder? and generally follow this set of instructions, skipping merging step II with no need for the freeware.
--

==================================================

II. Using MP3 Merger Freeware, merge all the CD?s (the entire audio book) that you have ripped/copied into a new, single mp3 file.
1. Open MP3 Merger freeware by clicking its icon on desktop. If you have only one CD or if you do not mind having a file for each CD, you can skip this step and go directly to III.
2. Click on ?Add Files? button
3. In Window that opens, browse to your iTunes Music Folder*** (see above)
4. Highlight the first nine of the mp3 files (each of the first 9 CD?s) you have ripped into iTunes (highlight first file, holding down shift, click on last file.)
5. For CD audio books with 9 or less CD?s, Click ?Open? at bottom of the select window to add all of the CD?s to MP3 Merger window
a. Click ?Sort List? button of MP3Merger. The files must be in proper sequence from top to bottom -? 1-5, 2-5, 3-5, etc.
b. Skip Step 6
6. For CD audio books with 10 or more CD?s (It may be easier to split books into numbered parts consisting of not more than 9 CD?s):
a. Add CD?s 1-9 altogether as a group (Step 5), then sort them
b. Add CD?s 10+, in order, one at a time.
7. After adding files to MP3 Merger list, Key in Artist (author), Title (Book Name), and Album (Book Name)
8. For ease of finding the file later, insert (key in) ?Book Name? in front of output.mp3 in Output File Name box.
9. Click ?Merge Files? button. This will create a new file called ?Book Name output.mp3,? or ?Book Name Part 1.mp3, in the same folder with the original CD files (iTunes Music Folder*** above). If files names differ even slightly, check ?Tolerate errors in MPEG headers before merging.? You now have both the merged file and individual original mp3 files, so that you temporarily have twice the size of the book on your hard disc.

III. Locate and Convert the merged mp3 file to AAC (Special Thanks to Stensvaag for the breakthrough)
1. So that ?Book Name output.mp3? (which has no genre), will show in iTunes, click on Browse in upper right corner until Genre, Artist, and Album no longer show.
2. Click on File/Add File to Library/
3. Window named ?Add to Library? containing ?Book Name output.mp3? file should appear. Highlight it and click on ?Open? button. If Book Name output.mp3 file does not appear in Add to Library Window, browse to the location of your iTunes files*** and look for ?Book Name output.mp3? file under Author?s name in un-alphabetized listing. Highlight it and click on Open.
4. In iTunes, Click on the top menu Edit > Preferences and click on the "Importing" Tab and select ?AAC Encoder?
5. Once in iTunes Library, highlight ?Book Name output.mp3? file. Right Click it, click ?Convert Selection to AAC.?
6. The conversion of a typical length book will take about an hour and a half and will use 95%+ of your cpu. Do not interrupt this process. You can return to progress indication in the center top window of iTunes by clicking on the > of that window.
IV. Rename the file, delete temporary files, and drag Book Name.m4b file to iTunes Library
1. After the conversion is complete, right click on the ?Output? file in iTunes Library and Select ?Show Songs File? In the resulting window:
2. Right click the ?output.m4a? file and select ?rename?
3. Key in rename to ?BookName.m4b ? (Space after b to be safe) See David's 4-22-04 solution posted in this thread if you can't see the extension name. Do not close this window until steps 4 & 5 are completed.
4. Highlight and delete all temporary *.mp3 files (one for each CD) visible in the Show Songs File Window, taking care not to delete the new *.m4b file.
5. Highlight and drag the ?Bookname.m4b? file from the ?Show Songs File window? to Library in Source Column of iTunes. Or, use iTunes File/Add File to Library
6. Highlight Bookname.m4b file in iTunes (see *** above), right click/Get Info -- add/change Name (Book Name) and Artist (Author) genre (Audiobook) as necessary.
7. Clear all temporary files from iTunes. Right click> Clear
8. Connect iPod to computer and use iTunes to drag and drop the newly created bookmarkable file from Library to iPod.
9. Optional:Change the importing back to mp3. (In iTunes, click on the top menu Edit > Preferences and click on the "Importing." Tab. At the ?Import Using? of the Importing Tab, drop down select ?mp3 encoding.?

Stensvaag

03-21-2004, 02:45 AM

Originally posted by robert
Would this work with a Audio Book CD? I am guessing not. However,

If so, could you spell out the steps. The thread is a little difficult for us non-technical types to follow.

This is neat.

Yes, absolutely. It does work with an Audio Book CD. Let's assume that you are starting with Audio CD #1 of the book "Da Vinci Code."

Step 1. Use iTunes to: (A) join all of the tracks on the Audio Book CD (so that you don't have a whole bunch of 5 minute files); (B) and convert the Audio CD tracks (now joined into a single track) to AAC.

Step 2. Find the resulting file that was created by Step 1 by displaying the "Date Added" column in iTunes. (Do Edit > View Options and check the item "Date Added"). If you then sort in reverse order by date added, your brand new file will be at the very top of the list.

Step 3. Fill in all the tags (fields) that you want on the file. I use short things for the "Song" or Track name like "Da Vinci 01"

Step 4. "Clear" the resulting file from the iTunes library (be careful not to actually delete it from your hard drive; when you are prompted and asked whether you want to send the file to your recycle bin, say "no"). You need to do this, because otherwise, Step 6 won't work (you'll have multiple copies of the same file in your iTunes library and you'll be confused).

Step 5. Find the AAC file that was created during the conversion process and use any Windows file utility like Windows Explorer to rename the file from *.m4p to *.M4B.

Step 6. Add the now newly renamed file to the iTunes library. You're done. The file, when played in iTunes or on the iPod will remember each time where you left off.

Repeat this for each of the Audio CDs, naming the (joined) tracks for each CD "Da Vinci 01" "Da Vinci 02" and so forth.

I wish the moderator could make this a sticky note, because it could be valuable for others who want to listen to Audio Book CDs on their iPods.

===========
Addendum: I just found an easier way to rename the AAC file. If you right-click on the "Song" (i.e., the AAC file) in iTunes, and select "Show Song File" you will be taken to a window in which you can rename the file extent to *.M4B. Then when you return to iTunes, and highlight the "Song" again, you will be warned with words that go something like: "Cannot find the file. Would you like to find it?" Answer "yes" and then navigate to the place where the renamed file is, selecting it.

dordale

03-21-2004, 02:48 PM

Stensvaag--

I agree this is important information to audio book lovers--

Maybe you should start a new thread with an appropriate title like "bookmarking non-audible files" and outline your steps. That way, interested people would be more likely to find the information. Hopefully the moderator would then be able to make it a sticky.

dordale :)

AmethystA

03-21-2004, 06:02 PM

Just a quick question, as I have several Book on Audio Tape. Can I use ITunes to copy them to MP3, or do I need the program mentioned in the first post of this thread? Thanks for starting this thread!

AmethystA

Stensvaag

03-21-2004, 06:28 PM

Originally posted by AmethystA
Just a quick question, as I have several Book on Audio Tape. Can I use ITunes to copy them to MP3, or do I need the program mentioned in the first post of this thread? Thanks for starting this thread!

AmethystA

If there is an option to do so with iTunes, I haven't been able to find it.

By the way, I have learned (the hard way) that PolderBitS Sound Recorder needs to have the option set to "Line-In" (only) to avoid having the audio file contaminated with all kinds of computer noises, like "You've Got Mail!"

Podunk

03-22-2004, 01:57 PM

This is a very handy technique, especially for dealing with audibooks that you may already have on CD (or tape) instead of Audible files.

Lets leave this one unsticky and see where it falls in the "natural selection" of things.

P

gshipley

03-22-2004, 02:24 PM

Just in case anyone is wondering, I tested this on my 2nd Gen 20gb iPod and it works great.

I am running 1.3 firmware and its a windows formatted iPod.

Also, I tired using a few freeware mp3 -> aac converters on Windows XP and it did not work.

I also tried sending the file to the iPod using ephpod 2.50, 2.60, and 2.78. None of those worked.

So it appears you have to convert the mp3 file to aac using iTunes.

Anyway, I just want to thank everyone for this tip. I only listen to audiobooks on my iPod and its a big pain to hit pause and not listen to anything else in order to preserve my place. It has been my dream feature for the iPod to bookmark mp3 books and now I have it! (With a littel work on my end)

Now all we need to do is set up a place to share our converted audio books in .M4B format. :) Only to save everyone who LEGALLY owns the books the trouble of joining files and converting and renaming etc.

Grant

robert

03-23-2004, 12:06 AM

Stensvaag

03-23-2004, 12:24 AM

Originally posted by robert
First dumb question. How do you join tracks? Under Advanced, Join Tracks is greyed out under any scenario I can think of to try. I find a post elsewhere that says tracks can only be joined at the time the cd is ripped, and that 'tracks' must be the sort. However, Advanced drop down "join tracks" is greyed out when doing this.

Help, please.

I hope I don't sound like a dope, but have you selected (highlighted) all of the tracks that you would like to have joined? If you haven't selected multiple tracks, you can't join them (that option will be greyed out). And they must be directly adjacent tracks (I'm assuming). That's why (I would guess) you need to have the CD sorted by "tracks."

Hope this silly suggestion does the trick!

gshipley

03-23-2004, 01:15 PM

I also get greyed out "Join Tracks" in iTunes. I remember it working once......

I just use a freeware program to do it and it works great!

http://mp3merge.netfirms.com/

I have been using it for a while now.

Grant

robert

03-23-2004, 05:17 PM

EDIT
Grayed out can be solved by
1. Highlighting all the tracks and/or
2. Clicking on the leftmost untitled column even if tracks are in order.

Originally posted by gshipley
I also get greyed out "Join Tracks" in iTunes. I remember it working once......

I just use a freeware program to do it and it works great!

http://mp3merge.netfirms.com/

I have been using it for a while now.

Grant
I am feeling very stupid and frustrated right now. Still greyed out on join CD tracks. However, The freeware above will combine all the MP3 -- and only MP3, not AAC -- tracks of a cd into one "output" file which can be renamed. It will not merge cd tracks of an AAC encoder import. iTunes/edit/preferences/importing/ and selecting MP3 Encoder allows one to merge all the cd tracks into one, and I suppose if I had imported all 8 CD's of the book that I could have merged all the tracks of all 8 CD's into one file (would really be nice to have the book all in one file if this worked). The resulting combined file appears as AAC (protected) file.
I can change the extension to M4B, but: A. Using right click on the renamed file to request a conversion to AAC, the file refuses to convert because "of an authorization error." B. This file will also not play.

File/import doesn't work, because its window accomodates only a .txt, .sml, or a .m3u file extension.

Step 1(A) and (B) above cannot be followed, since the freeware will not merge AAC format files. I can get individual tracks converted, but that would be something approaching 100 files for the book CD I am trying to put on my iPod.

.Edit: The solution to this problem and a complete step by step set of instructions is at my March 24 post in this thread: How to rip a complete audio book of CD's into one Bookmarkable File on PC

If we could use the freeware to merge all the tracks of all the cd's into one file, and then convert to AAC and change the extension to M4B, it would be a dream come true. iPod is so much more convenient than a cd player and there are some titles available on CD that are not at Audible.com.

I have searched and visited other threads in the forum that discuss these issues, and don't see a solution there:

!Join CD Tracks (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13407&highlight=joining+tracks)

iTunes 4 - Join CD Tracks greyed out (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5018&highlight=joining+tracks)

Converting MP3->AA and AA->MP3 (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14915&highlight=Bookmarking+audio)

arrrrrrrrghhhhhhhhhh! This is costing me valuable reading time.Edit: The solution to this problem and a complete step by step set of instructions is at my March 24 post in this thread: How to rip a complete audio book of CD's into one Bookmarkable File on PC

gshipley

03-23-2004, 07:43 PM

This is how I do it.

Rip the audio cd to mp3 on my hard drive using iTunes or whatever you like to rip.

Merge them all together using the freeware app creating one file output.mp3.

Rename to the book name (DaVinci Code)

import into iTunes as one mp3.

convert mp3 file to aac.

remove file from library but not erase.

change the filename to .M4B

re-add to iTunes library

copy to iPod

enjoy my new bookmarkable audio book.

It takes a few minutes, but its worth every second.

Grant

bsoplinger

03-24-2004, 09:02 AM

Wonder if its a PC vs Mac thing? I just stuck in an audio CD, iTunes querried CDDB and got the info, ejected the disc and re-mounted it with the correct name. I hightlighted the CD in the source area then all the tracks and Join CD Tracks is enabled. OS X 10.2.8, iTunes 4.2

I tried all tracks and a few different subset selections and it all works with every combo I could manage without taking all morning. I even tried sliding tracks so that noncontagious tracks seemed to be adjacent, ie 2, 4, 5 together. iTunes caught that and join was disabled. When I put 3 into the right place and had 2-5 selected join was once more enabled.

robert

03-24-2004, 02:12 PM

Originally posted by gshipley
This is how I do it.

Rip the audio cd to mp3 on my hard drive using iTunes or whatever you like to rip.

Merge them all together using the freeware app creating one file output.mp3.

Rename to the book name (DaVinci Code)

import into iTunes as one mp3.

convert mp3 file to aac.

Grant
When I get to the 'convert mp3 file to aac,' I am stuck. After I have successfully consolidated all the mp3 tracks into one file, renamed, and imported into iTunes, iTunes only shows 'convert selection to mp3' when I right click the highlighted consolidated file. The freeware above merges only mp3 tracks, so I had to rip the audio cd telling iTunes to use mp3 encoding.

Edit: The solution to this problem and a complete step by step set of instructions is at my March 24 post in this thread: How to rip a complete audio book of CD's into one Bookmarkable File on PC

Stensvaag

03-24-2004, 02:20 PM

Originally posted by robert
When I get to the 'convert mp3 file to aac,' I am stuck. After I have successfully consolidated all the mp3 tracks into one file, renamed, and imported into iTunes, iTunes only shows 'convert selection to mp3' when I right click the highlighted consolidated file. . . . .

In both those cases the files are already mp3 or already aac and iTunes is offering me the option of converting to the mode the file is already in. I can get the mp3 files to play, but not bookmark.
Bob

Robert . . .

In iTunes, Click on the top menu Edit > Preferences. Go to the tab marked "Importing." Look at the line headed: "Import Using." I assume that THIS is what you are offered when you right-click on a file/track in iTunes.

If you ripped a CD to AAC, and then right-click the track, it makes sense to me that your option would be (even if non-sensical) to "Covert to AAC" because that is what you set through your Preferences. If you ripped a CD to MP3 and right-click on the track, it makes sense that your option would be (even if non-sensical) "Convert to MP3" becuse that is what you set through your Prefences.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it is as simple as this and that all you need to do is fix that Prefence setting when you want to convert to the alternative format.

John-Mark

dordale

03-24-2004, 06:06 PM

Robert--

Glad you finally got this working! It took me a while to get it all sorted out myself (as you can see from my previous posts).

But figuring it out was well worth the effort--I am now able to listen to non-audible books, and switch over to listen to some music and not worry about trying to find my place in the book again.

Too bad apple hasn't seen fit to document this procedure (seems like they should be able to even set it up in iTunes as a preference without too many problems.)

Oh well--Thanks to people on this forum I definitely use my iPod smarter.

dordale :)

Stensvaag

03-24-2004, 07:34 PM

Robert . . .

I now wonder if you can skip some of these intermediate steps if you set your Edit > Preferences > Import With option to AAC. In other words, if you select that option, are you still hassled with the greyed out "Join CD Tracks"? Or is it possible for you to join them? (I wonder, in other words, if this was greyed out only because your preference was set to create an MP3 file).

If it IS possible join them, the option of having separate AAC (now M4B) files for each CD is very, very easy to use, as long as you name them sequentially and create a play list. You don't necessarily need to join all of the CDs into a single track.

I suggest this because it would save you loads of time in ripping audio book CDs (with joined tracks for each single CD) into AAC files that are quickly renamed to M4B files.

Please do get back to me about whether this will allow you to Join the tracks. I think this was your original problem, right?

John-Mark

robert

03-24-2004, 07:46 PM

Originally posted by Stensvaag
Robert . . .

I now wonder if you can skip some of these intermediate steps if you set your Edit > Preferences > Import With option to AAC. In other words, if you select that option, are you still hassled with the greyed out "Join CD Tracks"? Or is it possible for you to join them? (I wonder, in other words, if this was greyed out only because your preference was set to create an MP3 file).

If it IS possible join them, the option of having separate AAC (now M4B) files for each CD is very, very easy to use, as long as you name them sequentially and create a play list. You don't necessarily need to join all of the CDs into a single track.

I suggest this because it would save you loads of time in ripping audio book CDs (with joined tracks for each single CD) into AAC files that are quickly renamed to M4B files.

Please do get back to me about whether this will allow you to Join the tracks. I think this was your original problem, right?

John-Mark No, unfortunately, I just rechecked and as I remembered , the join CD tracks is greyed out with either aac or mp3 encoding selected.

Do you mean that one could probably skip the entire conversion process if the CD were imported in aac format. That is, skip your step 1B or have that conversion go through a much faster process? I think I remember having to "convert" these files in either format to get them to work in either mp3 or acc in iTunes while I was figuring out everthing. However, this happened very quickly when I did it, I think.

Even if join cd tracks weren't greyed out, I think I prefer having one file for my book that the MP3 merge permits. Maybe a matter of personal preference and I gather the trade off is slow hour and a half conversion from mp3 to aac of the large single MP3 file.

Thanks again for your help and for making the original post. You are going to make a lot of happy campers. The breakthrough was when you suggested that I change to import mp3 encoding when it came time to convert the mp3 file to aac. Since you can't merge aac tracks (that I know of), you have to switch the preferences back and forth.

robert

03-24-2004, 09:16 PM

I think I missed your point entirely and now see the possibilities:

Do you mean that possibly if join cd tracks is not greyed out that one could probably skip the entire conversion process if the CD were imported in aac format? That is, skip your step 1B or have that conversion go through a much faster process? I think I remember having to "convert" both mp3 and aac files while in iTunes to get them to play (I did get them to play, but w/o bookmarking). This was true for either mp3 or acc in iTunes while I was figuring out everthing. However, I think I remember that this happened very quickly when I did it, I think. The 'conversion' of a file already in a format must be much faster than the conversion from one to the other.

If that works, for those who don't have greyed out join cd tracks when importing with aac encoding, this could be a time saver if you you are ok with one "song" for each and aren't ok with the hour and a half conversion of the mp3 to aac.

If someone knows of a post-rip aac track merge software it might make this a really slick process.

Love this forum and this thread.

gshipley

03-24-2004, 11:30 PM

Most of the audiobooks that I have collected over the years are in either audible or mp3 format. I think its great to rip your books in mp3 format and go through the time to do the conversion in order have a copy in mp3. That way, you can share with your friends who don't have an iPod and can only listen in mp3 format.

I have found some freeware programs that will convert mp3 -> aac outside of iTunes but I did not have great success.

To give people an ideal of how long this process takes....

I have 3rd Degree (James Patterson) in 27 mp3 files totalling just over 6 hours of audio. The merge took about 20 seconds into one large file (3rdDegree.mp3) using the freeware program I listed earlier. Converting to aac in iTunes took around 18 minutes.

Was is worth the time? YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT! I just hope Apple doesnt patch iTunes so we can't do this in the future.

Podunk

03-25-2004, 12:15 AM

Originally posted by gshipley

Was is worth the time? YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT! I just hope Apple doesnt patch iTunes so we can't do this in the future.

Well, if they weren't already, they probably will start to work on plugging it when they see this thread. .:confused:

Sometimes, its better to just do things quietly, rather than calling attention to it on internet message boards

robert

03-25-2004, 12:30 AM

Perhaps we should limit ourselves to discussing how to put cd's which we have legitimately obtained on our iPods as the reason for this thread.

Could use a post or two edit to remove the red flags.

Apple will fix this before they address issues in 'Lost Bookmarks after Deep Sleep (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22554) and Bookmark no longer retained with 2.1 + iTunes 4.1.1 ( 1 2 3 ) (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13299) 1500 views between them.

david1951

03-26-2004, 07:41 PM

I really don't see why Apple should change this. In fact, they ought to be supporting it.

I don't see how converting audio books I already own into a format which is of most value on the iPod is any different from ripping a music CD I already own so that I can use it on the iPod.

Giving people COPIES of what I have ripped is of course illegal and a breach of copyright in the same way that giving people copies of music files I've ripped is illegal. But that's a different issue.

Unless Apple have some sort of exclusivity arrangement with Audible they should be helping us with this exercise.

(Don't get me wrong, I love Audible and buy lots of their books, but don't want to be locked into one source, particularly when Audible won't sell me lots of best seller books because I live outside the United States).

By the way, if anyone is interested in dubbing audio books from TAPE and putting them on the iPod, I do have some tips.

The only real difference in ripping from CD is that you have to record from the tapes in real time (generally as WAV) using any good audio edit program or even just the kind of recorder utility which comes with most sound cards. These files can then be converted to MP3 files, one for each tape side. From there, the process already described in this thread would apply.

Podunk

03-26-2004, 07:54 PM

David, you are right. I was being sarcastic......kind of.....sort of....maybe.... :)

But seriously, there's nothing wrong with anyone ripping their own CD audiobooks for their own personal use and converting the format to make them more user friendly.

HiTMaN

04-04-2004, 06:40 PM

WooHoo!!! Got this working. It reset your bookmark everytime you plug it into the computer though.

Podunk

04-08-2004, 06:49 PM

Originally posted by HiTMaN
WooHoo!!! Got this working. It reset your bookmark everytime you plug it into the computer though.

Well, thats a bit of a buzzkill for me. I just discovered the same thing. I plug in my iPod just about every day....small problem. :(

Stensvaag

04-12-2004, 09:49 AM

Originally posted by parannoya
Well, thats a bit of a buzzkill for me. I just discovered the same thing. I plug in my iPod just about every day....small problem. :(

Don't know why you are losing bookmarks when you plug in, but just wanted to report that I plug in constantly and have never yet lost a bookmark established through the new *.M4B file naming technique. I wonder whether it has something to do with whether you've checked iTunes to "AutoSynch" or some such thing?

Podunk

04-12-2004, 02:15 PM

yeah, sorry I should have specified. It happens when I plug in and resync (which is frequently). Its no problem if I just plug in for power.

Pantagruel

04-22-2004, 03:45 AM

Hi!
Just bought an ipod, and am reading up on all the cool "bookmarkable" stuff in here :)
I have been reading this thread with great interest, and followed all the steps to make a bookmarked file on my newly purchased pod, but something must have eluded me.....
And I am sure there's a simple explanation to this, apart from my being a little slow here....
How the darn tootin' does one change the name in the file from .m2a to .m4b?? Or .m4 B, for that matter?
I have a pc with winXP on it, and whenever I try to change the filname by right clicking on it, I am just able to change the name in, and not the file itself.
It's still an .m4a file.
I can call it something else allright, but it is still an .m4a file.
And that won't bookmark in itunes or on my ipod.

Please help me Obi Wan Ipolounger! You're my only hope!

There must be something I'n not getting......doh!

-Pantagruel

david1951

04-22-2004, 04:06 AM

On a Windows system, the file type is indicated by the file extension. For example, a Word document is indicated by an extension to the filename of .doc, for example MyCV.doc.

Sounds to me that you are just not seeing the extension, which is the bit you need to change to get bookmarkable files.

Now in their wisdom ( :confused: ) Microsoft decided it would be a real neat idea to hide these extensions for average users.

I don't have a Windows XP system running (hate it - never want to go past Windows 2000), but you will need to do something like this to see the extensions so you can change them:

1) Open up the folder with the converted files
2) Click on "Tools" on the menu bar of the folder.
3) Select "Folder Options"
4) Click on the "View" tab
5) Turn the checkmark OFF next to "Hide file extensions for known file types".
6) Hit OK and you should now be able to see the extensions of files.
7) Edit the .m4a extension to .m4b on the file you want to bookmark.

Hope this helps.

Pantagruel

04-22-2004, 04:22 AM

YESS!!!!!
Finally, I got it to work!!

Thankyouthankyouthankyou, David!

I am indeed the happiest camper online today!!
Juhuu!

Gb tanks!

Darn tootin' Microsoft..........

-Pantagruel

Pantagruel

04-22-2004, 04:25 AM

And I of course have to thank the Academy, all the Loungers who have contributed to my success and of course the Beatles' original Apple! :)

I'll stop now......

-Pantagruel

david1951

04-22-2004, 04:26 AM

My pleasure. Give my regards to Gargantua.

Podunk

04-22-2004, 10:01 PM

what the heck are you people talking about? :confused:

david1951

04-22-2004, 10:26 PM

Ah, parannoya... you're clearly missing the benefits of a classical education.

Gargantua and Pantagruel is a work by the 16th Century French author Francois Rabelais. Gargantua is a huge gross giant, and Pantagruel is his son. Among other characters is Dr Pangloss, who coined the phrase "All is for the best in this best of all possible worlds".

At least, I'm assuming this is the source of your puzzlement. Or were you puzzled by my explanation to Pantagruel as to how to fix his problem?

Podunk

04-22-2004, 10:44 PM

Gee, I don't think that one made it to the US in the sixteenth century. If it did, I must have missed it. :)

david1951

04-22-2004, 11:04 PM

Well, you know, we Aussies have to have SOMETHING to talk about while we're throwing another shrimp on the barbie...! ;)

Pantagruel

04-23-2004, 07:17 AM

Ah, and let's not forget Panurge either :)

BTW David, did you know that the wonderful 70's prog rock band; Gentle Giant made several references to Pantagruel and Panurge.
But then, not many people have heard about Gentle Giant.....
'tis a shame, indeed.

-Pantagruel

Pantagruel

04-23-2004, 07:20 AM

And a harty BTW to Parannoya too......didn't mean to leave you out of the loop here :)

-Pantagruel

Podunk

04-24-2004, 12:43 AM

So does that mean if I listen to Gentle Giant, I can count that as credit towards my education in 16th century classical literature?

If so, I'll just skip the book and listen to the CD. :)

Pantagruel

04-24-2004, 09:06 AM

Yup!
Take a closer look at Acquiring The Taste -71 and Octopus -72
There you have some harty mentionings of both Pantagruel and Panurge :)

Still recommend the book though. Maybe you can find it somwhere and make it a bookmarable one for your ipod :)

-Pantagruel

robert

04-28-2004, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by arsolot
New versions of both iTunes (http://www.apple.com/itunes/jukebox.html) and the iPod firmware (http://www.apple.com/ipod/download/) were announced today.

Does anyone know if these changes affect the bookmarking issues on which this [another] thread(Bookmark Not Retained on Deep Sleep) (http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13299) is focused? Do these changes help these issues or make them worse?

and do new versions affect bookmarking non-audible files solution in this thread as well?

gshipley

04-28-2004, 12:07 PM

Well, I just installed the new firmware on a 1.3 2nd Gen iPod. It did not update it to 2.1 as I thought, but updated it to 1.4.

This has absolutely no new feature that I can see for us 2nd users.

I tried playing a file I converted for bookmarking and it still bookmarks a non-audible file like it did.

I don't know if it fixed or broke anything else.

Pantagruel

04-28-2004, 12:43 PM

I just plunged right into it and installed the new version, making my newly bought 20 Gb ipod a version 2.2, instead of a 2.1.
And the bookmarking of an non-audible file still works :D

It's great! I am still a very happy camper!!

Next; to the installation of the new version of itunes.

To the skies!

-Pantagruel

arsolot

04-28-2004, 12:50 PM

Like gshipley, I've got a 2nd Gen. iPod. After upgradeing w/ the 4.5 version software, my iPod now shows ver 1.4 also.

This morning, I lost my bookmark just like I have many times before: I attempted to play the book, but it instead skipped ahead to the next item in the playlist (another Audible download). When I went back to the book I was first attempting to play, the bookmark was lost and the book was starting over at 0:00 time, and I had to find my place again. I DID NOT touch the FF or RW button or anything else to cause this to occur.

Conclusion: 4.5 upgrade does nothing to the bookmarking issues that we've been discussing at length.

lego72

04-29-2004, 03:02 AM

Hi there,
Thanks very much for providing this guide.

I have been having a problem converting mp3 files to aac format (m4a).

I am using iTunes and have set the encoding to AAC as the guide says. I right click on the song/book that needs to be converted and click Convert to AAC. A second file appears (I believe this is correct) and then wait for the conversion to finish.

However on some, usually longer books (+6 hours), the time on the new track will be (a lot) shorter than the original track. And when I listen to the end of the new track I can hear that it just cuts off.

Does anyone know why it does this? It doesn't happen with all conversions (I have only done 6 or so).

I am using XP Pro with iTune 4.2 (just got 4.5 so will try with that too). I have also tried it with a Mac - OX 10 and got the same result.

Anything on this would be great.

Thanks in advance
Tim

robert

05-23-2004, 03:32 PM

robert

05-24-2004, 02:07 AM

Originally posted by Stensvaag
The only time "Join Tracks" has been grayed out for me has been when the CD tracks are "sorted" within iTunes by something OTHER than the first column (i.e., the one to the left of "Song Name"). Every time I ran into the grayed-out phenomenon, it drove me nuts until I figured this simple trick out. Hope it helps!

If ?Join Tracks? is grayed out another possibility is all tracks must be selected/highlighted and/or click on left-most column until re-ordered into 1, 2, 3, etc., sequence -- even if tracks are already in sequence. Many thanks to Stensvaag for grayed-out solution!

robert

05-24-2004, 06:36 PM

Sweet smart playlist solutionOriginally posted by MikeM http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32901

.........

Then, make a smart playlist with the criteria being the artist or album name of the book and play count = 0 [or how many times the files have already been played]. Now, when you listen to a 'track', it will leave the list. And if you stop in the middle of track, its bookmarked and will pick up right where you left off.

I was hoping to load the files into the smartlist so that they would appear and execute in order -- I would anticipate that the listened to files would disappear from smart list and iPod would move on the the next file in sequence, but mine are all jumbled.

Not a safe thing to try to get on right file while going 70 mph.

Anyone know how to order the files on iPod so that they will "flow" in sequence?

robert

05-24-2004, 06:36 PM

david1951

05-25-2004, 12:32 AM

Approach 1:

In the Smart Playlist:

1) check "Limit to"
2) put in a large number, equal or greater than the number of tracks
3) Next to "Selected by" choose "song name"

This presumes that the "song" names have been ripped into a format which means you can sort them numerically. Eg, mine are usually like HP01_01, HP01_02 for the first disk, HP02_01 etc for the next disc.

Approach 2:

What also works if your songs aren't named this way is to open up the playlist showing the list of tracks, use View Options to show the track numbers and click on that column to sort into order. Surprisingly, iTunes seems to retain that order in the Smart Playlist. I was even able to copy the Smart Playlist onto the iPod and it stayed ordered.

robert

05-25-2004, 12:37 AM

OK, I got my files to show in sequence in Smart list on iPod (The list is really neat looking and with disc number first, it is easy to see). I anticipate that this smart list will eliminate files as they are read and go onto the next file in sequence without my having to manually select the next file. This allows one to rip in AAC at a faster speed, eliminate need to merge mp3 files and lengthy and cpu hog conversion of mp3 to AAC, and easier file management.

Did the following:

Creating smart list:

Artist = Author
Album = Book Name
Play Count = 0
Check Live Updating

Removed the number designations iTunes assigned to each m4a file, renaming as ?X. Book Name.m4b,? from 1-01 Book Name.m4a (X = disc number)
checked compilation box in get info window,
changed track numbers to same as disc numbers (X of Y),
dragged and dropped files individually ? lowest number first from iTunes to iPod Play list (not the smartlist)

So, anyone have an idea which of these steps is/are unnecessary?

Gonna let this rest and I am out of audio CD?s to copy.

david1951

05-25-2004, 12:58 AM

robert :

I generally don't use iTunes to rip my files. I use dBPowerAMP or Music Match to rip them into MP3 format. I specify a naming convention which results in files which when sorted alphabetically are in the correct order. (Album name = "HP01", Song Name = Album + Track #).

With the second approach I suggested, I've now tested the sorting exercise. My track numbers show as 1,2,3,4 etc. When I sort those in the Smart Playlist, the re-ordering seems to stick, and the auto drop off when the track is heard still works.

If you want to go to AAC so you can bookmark within tracks you may be stuck with the limitations of iTunes.

robert

05-25-2004, 01:03 AM

AAC iTunes audio book rip results in song names coming out 'X-1 Book Name.m4a.' I renamed to '1. Book Name.m4b.' (X=disc number.)

I looked at track numbers and apparently my changing of track numbers to that of disc number did not stick or something. So, looks like track numbering is not how I got my sequencing right. Eliminated that one from my list.

I sorted columns in iTunes to no avail.

Leaves:

Removed the number designations iTunes assigned to each m4a file, renaming as ?X. Book Name.m4b,? from 1-01 Book Name.m4a (X = disc number)
checked compilation box in get info window,
dragged and dropped files individually ? lowest number first from iTunes to iPod Play list (not the smartlist)

My brain is fried, going to leave this until tomorrow.

Thanks,

Robert

david1951

05-25-2004, 01:12 AM

No, sorry, the second approach DOESN'T work.

It's all fine inside iTunes. But if you create the playlist inside the iPod, the iPod insists on putting the playlist in alphabetical order of the song names (which is what the smart playlist actually tells it to do - it's just that I thought I could override it with the track number order).

There's actually something very funny going on if you create a smart playlist in your Library in iTunes and then drag the smart playlist into the iPod. Seems to retain the order if you do that, but NOT if you create it directly on the iPod icon (in iTunes). Must do some more experiments.

robert

05-25-2004, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by david1951
No, sorry, the second approach DOESN'T work.

It's all fine inside iTunes. But if you create the playlist inside the iPod, the iPod insists on putting the playlist in alphabetical order of the song names (which is what the smart playlist actually tells it to do - it's just that I thought I could override it with the track number order).

There's actually something very funny going on if you create a smart playlist in your Library in iTunes and then drag the smart playlist into the iPod. Seems to retain the order if you do that, but NOT if you create it directly on the iPod icon (in iTunes). Must do some more experiments.

David,

Given all that and a fresh look, I am betting my successful ordering was the result of one of two things, or both:

When renaming the AAC ripped files disposing of the pre-fix assigned by iTunes and substituting the disk number (creating a simple alphabetizing), and/or
dragging and dropping files singly, beginning with the lowest numbered disc.

I am hoping it is only the former. I have the promise of three audio cd's and will try all this with a rip this evening and hopefully be in the postion post a Dummy's guide to bookmarkable AAA encode rip, smart playlist solution as described above. I have it all down but for how one gets the files in order on iPod.

Seems like if we could figure out how to order files in smart list that it would be possible to put all ripped audio cd's in the same smart list by adding artist/album for each with the alphabetizing taking care of separating the books by listing the album files together in sequence. Thinking out loud, would not 1. Book Name , 2. Book Name, 1. Other Book Name, 2. Other book name, etc, fall in sequence? I will give that a try.

GearHead

05-25-2004, 01:39 PM

Robert,

What works for me is as follows:

When ripping into iTunes, make sure you have "Create File Names With Track Numbers" off. You can find that checkbox under the Import Tab under preferences.
Next, before each disc is imported, for the disc information, I use the Author name under "Artist", the Book title under "Album", and of course the Song name fills in automatically with book title. I also put "Spoken Word" under "Genre" and fill in the "Disc #" field (Disc XX of XX)
After each disc is imported, I change the Song Name by adding the disc number at the end of the name. So, for instance, I recently imported "By Sorrow's River" - the Song Name for Disc 1 is: "By Sorrow's River01" continuing all the way through "By Sorrow's River10". Using this method, you can group them in easy order by song title, and it is important to use a two digit naming convention (01 vs 1) to maintain the proper order.

Create a Smart Playlist with "Spoken Word" as Genre and click "Match Only Checked", then sort by Song Name, and you're golden. Each book in that Smart Playlist will be grouped together, and in order. Every time I sync the iPod, I uncheck the volumes I've listened to for each book, and they disappear. It has worked brilliantly so far.

By the way, for whatever reason my bookmarks have NOT been erased after syncing the iPod for my M4B files. I know this is contrary to what other people have experienced, but I can't explain it.

Hope this helps; let me know if you have any questions.

david1951

05-25-2004, 08:06 PM

GearHead's approach (using leading zeroes for track/disc numbers is important) combined with the SmartList techique of including a condition that the play count = 0, seems to solve this whole thing.

GearHead

05-25-2004, 08:22 PM

Originally posted by david1951
GearHead's approach (using leading zeroes for track/disc numbers is important) combined with the SmartList techique of including a condition that the play count = 0, seems to solve this whole thing.

Great point, David. With adding the "play count = zero" condition, you don't have to manually do anything beyond importing in a specific way. The playlist takes care of all of the work!

robert

05-26-2004, 12:18 AM

Ok, I got most of it:

Posted at Complete Beginner?s Guide for Copying Audio CD?s into a Bookmarking iTunes/iPod file (http://ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=201254#post201254)

Thanks to all the help. I am still puzzled by issues on second post of new thread above.

hans-jürgen

08-22-2004, 02:19 PM

Originally posted by Stensvaag
Here's my question: Does anyone know of a program that will take audiotape input (like polderbits) and immediately convert it to AAC files, rather than MP3 files, so that I can skip this step? There are several freeware applications that can record any input from the sound card line-in to either WAV or lossy compression formats like AAC or MP3. Some CD rippers are able to this, too, e.g. Audiograbber or CDex.

But my recommendation would be foobar2000 with faac.exe. I added a short description with links today in the iPod Windows software forum in the Sticky thread, so I won't repeat everything here.

For your purpose it should be mentioned that foobar2000 has a recording module that you will find under "Components", not in the "Preferences". After setting it to your preferred input values (for speech coding you wouldn't need 44.1 kHz sample rate, rather 32 or 24 kHz and maybe also mono instead of stereo), you just combine it with the output disk writer module and choose "Command line encoder: FAAC" there.

You have to edit its parameters to useful speech settings before you start the recording though, i.e. a VBR quality of 75% with -q 75 or less depending on your needs, and also add the -w switch for wrapping the AAC bitstream into the MP4 container. It's also necessary to define stdin as input with an additional "-" in the parameter box, because there is no input file with this method. The output file name is set with -o %d, so a complete line would read: -q 75 -w - -o %d

In the file extension box you should use "m4b", then you don't have to rename the resulting files afterwards.

That's about it, and if your PC is fast enough (i.e. 200 MHz or more), you should be able to do real-time AAC/MP4 encodings from your audio tapes without recording huge temporary WAV files in between. If it's slower that that, it might happen that FAAC will lose some frames, and then you would have to record to WAV first and do the encoding in a separate step.

Stensvaag

08-24-2004, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by hans-j??rgen
[B]For your purpose it should be mentioned that foobar2000 has a recording module that you will find under "Components", not in the "Preferences". After setting it to your preferred input values (for speech coding you wouldn't need 44.1 kHz sample rate, rather 32 or 24 kHz and maybe also mono instead of stereo), you just combine it with the output disk writer module and choose "Command line encoder: FAAC" there.

Thanks for all these tips. It sounds very promising but, unfortunately, I am lost part way through trying to use this technique.

1. I have installed Foobar2000 and can run it.

2. I have downloaded FAAC.EXE and am pretty clueless about where to put this on my hard drive or how to use it.

3. Within Foobar2000 itself, I can find all the Component stuff, but cannot figure out how to get to a place where I can do what you say above: "just combine it with the output disk writer module and choose 'Command line encoder: FAAC' there."

I tried to search through the site with everything about FAAC and how to use it, but just got more confused. Would appreciate future guidance. Thanks!

John-Mark

hans-jürgen

08-24-2004, 02:32 PM

2. I have downloaded FAAC.EXE and am pretty clueless about where to put this on my hard drive or how to use it. Just put it in the foobar2000 main directory, so that the program can find it. Another possibility is to put it in any directory that is listed in the PATH= setting in your autoexec.bat (if you still have this batch file in your Windows version). The main Windows directory would work, too.

3. Within Foobar2000 itself, I can find all the Component stuff, but cannot figure out how to get to a place where I can do what you say above: "just combine it with the output disk writer module and choose 'Command line encoder: FAAC' there." OK, if you click on "Record" in foobar2000, you first see the Recorder setup where you can choose the properties of the line-in input bitstream, i.e. your audio tape in this case. Normally you wouldn't change anything here (44.1 kHz sample rate, 16 bits per sample, 2 channels), but you may for speech coding, e.g. 32 or 24 kHz, 16bit, mono. This will reduce "the amount" of bits to encode right at the start and is a common method to achieve a better compression efficiency at low bitrates. For example iTunes does this, too. The device in the Recorder setup is either the generic Microsoft Audio Mapper or the driver of your sound card, both options should work.

The next step is "Selecting a file writer preset" where you should get a dropdown list of possible Command line encoders, among them FAAC with the default setting -q 100. If you don't see this list, you may not have installed foobar2000 with the CLI interface, i.e. foo_clienc.dll in the Components subdirectory of foobar2000. By the way, you should have downloaded the Special Installer (~2.3 MB) with all plugins included and choose a full installation with it.

For simply testing you should just click on OK here, give the test file some name with a *.mp4 file extension in the "Save as..." box and start the recording, i.e. something has to be connected to your line input (activated in the Windows audio mixer settings) and produce some sound (a tape, a radio, whatever). After some seconds click on "Stop", locate the recorded file with "Add to playlist" in foobar2000 and try to play it.

For a preset that better fits to your purpose you have to edit the default -q 100 preset to the one I already suggested, i.e. simply copy that given parameter line or type the different switches manually in the "Edit" box of that preset. You can find this box under "Preferences" -> "Diskwriter" -> "Output presets" -> "Command line encoder: FAAC -q 100" -> "Edit". You can also use another name for your personal preset there, e.g. "FAAC audio books" or something like that.

Don't hesitate to ask if I left out too much again... ;)

Stensvaag

08-24-2004, 09:33 PM

I really appreciate your patience. It was surprisingly hard for me to find foo_clienc.dll on the web (bizarrely, it did not seem to install even with the Special Installer package), but I finally located it and put it where it belongs.

I am now 95% of the way, but get this error message when I click the Stop button during the record phase:

"WARNING (CORE) : file info update failure on : file://C:\Temp3\TEST03.M4B"

It may be that you can't help me with this. If so, I'll just abandon my effort, but you've worked so hard to help out that I thought you deserved the courteousness of a reply.

Thanks again for all you've done to get me down the road on this.

hans-jürgen

08-25-2004, 03:12 AM

It was surprisingly hard for me to find foo_clienc.dll on the web (bizarrely, it did not seem to install even with the Special Installer package), but I finally located it and put it where it belongs. That's very strange, where did you download the Special Installer of foobar2000? Anyhow, here's the website of Case (the developer of foo_clienc and other parts) where you can easily find the newest foobar2000 version and many plugins, too, among them foo_clienc:

http://www.saunalahti.fi/cse/foobar2000/?C=M;O=D

And don't forget to choose "full install" when installing it. It might be that foo_clienc is not included in the default standard installation routine.

I am now 95% of the way, but get this error message when I click the Stop button during the record phase:

"WARNING (CORE) : file info update failure on : file://C:\Temp3\TEST03.M4B"

Right, that's due to the fact that foobar2000 cannot recognize the *.m4b file extension yet, so you couldn't play these files with it, only in iTunes or on your iPod. But they are OK, you can verify this when renaming them to *.m4a and right-clicking them in foobar's playlist to check their properties. The error message simply states that foobar cannot tag the *.m4b file with the usual Title tag that it would add to a *.m4a file ("Recording: 44100 Hz 16 bps 2ch"). So it's not important, and you can also choose to ignore = not show these error messages in foobar2000.

It may be that you can't help me with this. If so, I'll just abandon my effort, but you've worked so hard to help out that I thought you deserved the courteousness of a reply. It is fun for me to explore new possibilities for FAAC and foobar2000, so it wasn't a hard work at all. I agree that there are some small quirks that you have to get around like the Title tag for *.m4b files, but in my opinion this method is probably the most flexible and fastest method to encode anything to *.m4b files. You could also rip CDs with foobar2000, by the way.

If you're still interested, I could contact Case to suggest some improvements like adding this file extension to foobar2000 or expanding the recorder with start and stop times for scheduled recordings.

Stensvaag

08-25-2004, 03:58 PM

Got it working now. Thanks for sticking with me!

robert

08-26-2004, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by hans-j??rgen
...here's the website of Case (the developer of foo_clienc and other parts) where you can easily find the newest foobar2000 version and many plugins, too, among them foo_clienc:

http://www.saunalahti.fi/cse/foobar2000/?C=M;O=D

And don't forget to choose "full install" when installing it. It might be that foo_clienc is not included in the default standard installation routine.

Right, that's due to the fact that foobar2000 cannot recognize the *.m4b file extension yet, so you couldn't play these files with it, only in iTunes or on your iPod. But they are OK, you can verify this when renaming them to *.m4a and right-clicking them in foobar's playlist to check their properties. The error message simply states that foobar cannot tag the *.m4b file with the usual Title tag that it would add to a *.m4a file ("Recording: 44100 Hz 16 bps 2ch"). So it's not important, and you can also choose to ignore = not show these error messages in foobar2000.

... there are some small quirks that you have to get around like the Title tag for *.m4b files, but in my opinion this method is probably the most flexible and fastest method to encode anything to *.m4b files. You could also rip CDs with foobar2000, by the way.

If you're still interested, I could contact Case to suggest some improvements like adding this file extension to foobar2000 or ...

And here is the link to hans-j??rgen's post, referred to in another of his posts, in iPod Windows software thread:

http://ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=263673#post263673

Hans and Stensvaag,

with You could also rip CDs with foobar2000, by the way.

I smell a possible solution to getting bookmarkable files onto iPod from CD/DVD mp3 files and audio files without going through time- and computer-hogging aac conversion in iTunes. That would be so cool to find a way to convert mp3 and audio files to bookmarkable m4b files without aac conversion.

If this is possible could one of you please outline the basics of how to in as non-technical language as you can? I was about to post a beginner's guide to converting CD/DVD mp3 files to bookmarkable iTunes/iPod files and it would be lovely to post an easier solution that didn't require aac conversion.

I have just converted three long books from mp3 to m4b and it exhausts me and my computer. Thanks to help in this thread, I reduced the kbs to 32 kbs and therefore the files to under 120 meg which solved the stuttering and skipping on iPod of longer files. That kbs reduction also reduced the aac conversion from hours to about 20 minutes per six hours of audio book. Apple obviously doesn't want anyone importing mp3 files directly into aac format for iTunes. The CD, and its mp3 files, doesn't even show on the source column and trying to copy and import from hard disc doesn't work either.

Thanks,

Robert

hans-jürgen

08-26-2004, 07:06 PM

I'm not sure if there is a misunderstanding in your ideas, because you always have to convert anything to AAC (the compression format) and put it in the MP4 container with the special file extension *.m4b, no matter if you use iTunes or foobar2000/FAAC. As I don't have iTunes myself, I don't understand your method of producing *.m4b files with it and why it takes so long. But I'm quite sure that iTunes can take MP3 files and convert them directly to MP4 files with *.m4a file extension which should work rather flawlessly. The only additional step should be the renaming to *.m4b in my opinion, but maybe I'm wrong.

And yes, using foobar's CDDA plugin (should also be part of the Special Installer) enables direct CD ripping from audio CDs. Converting MP3 files (from a data CD or HDD) is an even easier task, because you just add the MP3 files to the playlist, select them and choose "Convert" from the context menu with the settings as described before.

By the way, today I found a Winamp plugin that enables playback of *.m4b (and *.m4p) files. It's downloadable as an attachment to this thread in the Winamp forums:

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?postid=1344136

So this is one of the rare occasions where Winamp is ahead of foobar2000... ;)

robert

08-26-2004, 11:23 PM

Originally posted by hans-j??rgen
... But I'm quite sure that iTunes can take MP3 files and convert them directly to MP4 files with *.m4a file extension which should work rather flawlessly. The only additional step should be the renaming to *.m4b ....

And yes, using foobar's CDDA plugin (should also be part of the Special Installer) enables direct CD ripping from audio CDs. Converting MP3 files (from a data CD or HDD) is an even easier task, because you just add the MP3 files to the playlist, select them and choose "Convert" from the context menu with the settings as described before.

By the way, today I found a Winamp plugin that enables playback of *.m4b (and *.m4p) files. It's downloadable as an attachment to this thread in the Winamp forums:

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?postid=1344136

So this is one of the rare occasions where Winamp is ahead of foobar2000... ;)

Yes, you are correct, the process on iTunes is:

1.Manually copy mp3 files onto hard disk, removing mp3 files from folders into one.
2.Merge the mp3 files of the book using free ware (see 2nd link below)
3.Add the merged mp3 file to iTunes
4.Click on merged mp3 file in iTunes to request conversion to aac
5.Wait 20 minutes per 6 hours of audio for conversion
6.Rename resulting file to m4b
7.Add renamed m4b file(s) to iTunes and thence to iPod
8.Delete mp3 folders and files and merged files.

There is an alternative method which results in a file for each CD for importing audio book (only) CD files into iTunes as aac files. It doesn't take nearly as much time or computer resource. That process is at http://ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33491

iTunes will not show an mp3 CD (and presumably an mp3 DVD) in its source column (as it does an audio book or music cd which can be imported directly into iTunes as an aac file).

To import mp3 files into iTunes I am using a variant of the process at: http://ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=31295

So, would your suggested freeware accomplish reading mp3 file onto hard disc while converting it to aac simultaneously and quickly? Having discovered sources of mp3 audio books on CD/DVD's, I am interested in a faster and easier method than that above and in posting it as a Beginner's Guide to converting mp3 audio book files to bookmarkable m4b files for use on iPod.

Thanks,

Robert

hans-jürgen

08-27-2004, 04:11 AM

So, would your suggested freeware accomplish reading mp3 file onto hard disc while converting it to aac simultaneously and quickly? Having discovered sources of mp3 audio books on CD/DVD's, I am interested in a faster and easier method than that above and in posting it as a Beginner's Guide to converting mp3 audio book files to bookmarkable m4b files for use on iPod. Yes, foobar2000 can easily convert MP3 files to M4B in one step, even to one single file if you really think that's easier to handle. In the context menu of the "Convert" option you can choose "Run conversion, single file output" with several highlighted MP3 files instead of the usual method. But I'm not convinced that this is necessary and easier than having several M4B files, e.g. one for each chapter of an audio book, if they are sorted and played in the correct order (usually achieved with a leading track number in the file name which foobar2000 uses automatically when converting).

Anyhow, MP3 files on CDs/DVDs should be directly accessible with one of the "Playlist" options, because the CD-ROM drive is shown in these boxes with the normal drive letter, so adding them to the foobar2000 playlist should work, and you wouldn't have to copy them first to your HDD. But I can't test this, because I don't have such data CDs or DVDs.

With an audio CD in your drive foobar2000 shows the individual tracks as *.cda files, so converting them to *.m4b (either into one or several files) shouldn't be a problem. But as you might have guessed, I didn't test this ;) , because my CD-ROM drive is from the stone age, and nor foobar2000 neither other CD rippers want to work with it at all.

Ichijoe

08-27-2004, 06:44 AM

Why in Hell would you all want to use Third-Party Software is beyound me!?!? :confussed:

Now whatever your poblem against Apple or iTunes is, I find iTunes the best tool to do it. (For now!)...

Irregardless of your Medium CD / Mp3 / Ogg (needs Applescript /or .dll File: to play in iTunes). All One needs to do is to use the 'Convert to AAC' in iTuens! I never used Foobar but I have used DBPowerAmp. and DBPowerAmp S??CK'S compaird to the simple and userfriendly iTunes AAC interface settings! Now I'm not gonna get into Bitsettings (to each there own ears!)

But, once the convewrsion is done, and yes it can take over an Hour if you have a L o n g B o o k get over it! Click Start-> Search: Search all Files and Folders for: .m4a (iTunes defaults to .m4a AAC Unprotected!),. Once you have the File in question rename that extension to .m4b (Bookmark enabled Protected) or if your lucky '.m4b ' (W/O the '' I use them to denote the Fourth space. which makes the file unprotected.)

Note: you may have to (In Windows Explorer), Click Tools->Folder Options->View: Show Hidden Files and Folder, and uncheck the hide Extensions box. Apply and exit! If you know where iTunes is writeing it's Files to. (i.e. x:\Documents and Settings\User\My Documents\My Music\iTunes\iTunes Music) you could just open Windows Explorer up and go stright in! no need to Search then!

Ichijoe

08-27-2004, 06:50 AM

Now after Six Pages and nearly Eighty Posts in this Thread are we any closer to importing any Chapter Breaks into our '.M4b's'??
I mean this is a great hack and all but, this is not like haveing to rewrite code and it knind of amazes me that that this Thread is so large. I mean whats not to understand? It's simply a Two step process, of Importing and then Renameing. It's no wonder why People hate Linux if they are to ignerent to simply do something as simple as this!

hans-jürgen

09-17-2004, 06:36 AM

M4B support in foobar2000

There's a patched version of foo_input_std.dll available that enables tagging and playback of this bookmarkable iTunes/iPod audio book file format in foobar2000:

http://www.loodi.com/foo_input_std_M4B_SUPPORT.zip

The explanation how to encode/transcode audio books with FAAC v1.24+ command line version and foo_pod.dll to this format can be found in this thread, see the following page, too:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=19156&view=findpost&p=241450

The drawback vs. an "official" version of the input DLL is that files with .mp4 extension cannot be played back any longer, because the patch substitutes this file extension with .m4b. A better idea would have been to eliminate .m4p in my opinion, but for audio book fans it shouldn't matter. An even better solution would be to simply include it as an additional MPEG-4 Audio format.

mkral

10-30-2004, 09:30 AM

Where is the Scripts Menu in the apple version of itunes? I just downloaded the applescript to convert some AAC's to m4b's, but I cannot for the life of me find a scripts or applescripts menu in itunes (v 4.7) Am I missing something? I followed all of the instructions, made the itunes scripts folder, dropped the script in there, restarted itunes (several times) and ....nothing.

Ichijoe

10-31-2004, 04:48 AM

-> mkral

Are you on a PC or Mac? It might sound a bit dumb and argent of me to say this but, Apple Scripts are for Mac's only...

If you should be on a PC, all you need to do is to bring your Source Matrial to the PC (i.e. convert it to a Machine readable .Mp3 or .AAC) If your stuff is on CD it should be as simmple as ploping that Pupy in the Tray and useing iTunes to rip it. Straight to AAC (.M4a). at which point you would hit the 'Windows Key + E' (to bring up the Windows Explorer and then hit the F3 Key to search the for the Extension *.M4a.
Once located just rename that File to '*.M4b'. It's that simple.

mkral

10-31-2004, 08:08 AM

sorry about that, yah I"m on a mac.

iTunes Genius

02-20-2005, 06:02 PM

HELLO

I HAVE FOUND THE PERFECT WAY TO TURN ANY OF YOUR NONE-AUDIABLE TRACKS INTO AUDIABLE TRACKS.

1. FIRST OPEN THE TRACK IN I-TUNES.

2. CLICK EDIT>PREFERENCES>IMPORTING>IMPORT USING
AND SELECT 'AAC ENCODER'

3. PRESS OK TO SAVE CHANGES

4. WITH THE TRACK(S) HIGHLIGHTED, CLICK ADVANCED>CONVERT
SELECTION TO AAC

5. CHANGE THE NAME BY ADDING VVV,XX,ZZZZ etc. AT THE END
SO IT IS DIFFERENT FROM THE ORIGINAL.
IT WILL SAY "CONVERTING..." AS THE TRACK CONVERTS.

6. GO TO THE MUSIC FOLDER WHERE THE TRACK IS SITUATED.

7. CHANGE THE EXTENSION TYPE TO [.M4b]

8. RE-OPEN THE TRACK IN ITUNES. DELETE THE ORIGINAL AND
CHANGE THE NAME OF THE CONVERTED BACK TO NORMAL.
DRAG INTO YOUR IPOD ICON AS USUALX AND THERE YOU HAVE
YOUR VERY OWN AUDIABLE TRACK.

GOOD LUCK!!!!!

PLEASE EMAIL ME FOR FULL PRINTABLE INSTRUCTIONS WITH COMPLETE DIAGRAMS AND EXPLANATIONS (sam_iam_2004@hotmail.com)

robert

02-20-2005, 09:32 PM

Where have you been, genius? Did you even bother to look at the stickies at the head of the forum -- dated may '04?

Why don't you compare your instructions to the guides and decide whether or not to delete your post, and I will mine, so this now misleading thread will scamper back into its valuable history?

Podunk

02-20-2005, 10:55 PM

Originally posted by iTunes Genius
HELLO

I HAVE FOUND THE PERFECT WAY TO TURN ANY OF YOUR NONE-AUDIABLE TRACKS INTO AUDIABLE TRACKS.

uhh.... you may be a genius but you are over a year behind on this one. :)

dennish

05-17-2005, 06:26 PM

I am using an ipod mini for audible.com books and am having problems with bookmarking- the ipod doesn't do it. I have seen references to resetting the ipod as a solution and tried this based on instructions from the manual, but it hasn't worked. Any suggestions?

Podunk

05-18-2005, 12:30 AM

If soft reset doesn't fix it, the next step is a firmware restore. Have you tried that?

robert

05-18-2005, 02:18 AM

try updating your iPod mini firmware version first. The newest mini firmware does faster speed on audio books, etc.

dennish

05-18-2005, 08:03 AM

No I haven't how do you do that?

robert

05-18-2005, 09:45 AM

http://www.apple.com/ipod/download/

dennish

05-18-2005, 12:37 PM

I was able to download the latest firmware, but haven't had a chance to use it on the audio. will let you know how things work. thanks for the tip.

MacMaven

05-18-2005, 01:53 PM

Stevenvaag asks how to convert the files from his audio tapes which he has brought into his computer as mp3. I suggest he import the files into iTunes. change the prefs in iTunes to convert to AAC while importing. i bring books on CD in that way. iTunes can automatically make them AAC as they come in.

robert

05-18-2005, 03:57 PM

Originally posted by MacMaven
Stevenvaag asks how to convert the files from his audio tapes which he has brought into his computer as mp3. I suggest he import the files into iTunes. change the prefs in iTunes to convert to AAC while importing. i bring books on CD in that way. iTunes can automatically make them AAC as they come in.

LOL. Stensvaag introduced this forum to converting tapes and cds to bookmarkable in Spring of '04, so I think that he has it figured. You were nice to offer up a solution. See the guides in signature below. All have their genesis in Stevensaag's audio tape discussion, which began with the first post in this thread.

You are nice to try, though. Look thru the stickies at the beginning of the Books and Spoken Word forum

umut

06-03-2005, 06:09 AM

Originally posted by dordale
Stensvaag--

when my file is in itunes, it remembers where it last was when I go back to it. But--files with .m4b extensions that I've transferred to my iPod don't "bookmark".

Have you been able to get this to work with files on your iPod, or only in iTunes?
dordale :)

I've encountered the same problem with my iPod shuffle on Win XP.

When you connect the iPod, the file in your library is bookmarked, too. Check this first, and then delete the file on iPod and transfer the bookmarked local file to iPod again. That solved my problem.

dordale

06-03-2005, 01:38 PM

Umut--

Thanks for your reply, but if you would have read further into the posts, you would have realized that I resolved this program over a year ago (March 2004) :) I did indeed discover that I wasn't transferring the re-named m4b file to my iPod correctly, but was transferring my original mp3 files over.

dordale :)

dennish

06-04-2005, 11:00 AM

I have been having sporadic problems with my mini. So I decided to do a reset. When I reconnect the ipod to the pc to copy the music etc from itunes to the ipod, i get the following error-
"Windows- Delayed Write Failed
Windows was unable to save all of the data for the file \Device\Harddisk\2DP(1)0-0+17Pod_Control\Music\F25\Z5AA.m4a. The data has been lost. This error maybe caused by a failure of your computer hardware or network connection. Please try to save this file elsewhere"

Podunk

06-04-2005, 11:56 AM

wrong thread altogether. you're not likely to get an answer to that question in this thread. you may want to delete it an repost it in a more approriate section of the forum.