New IPOD....so many questions...

[parvo99]

Hi,
I finally gave in and got myself an ipod:D . Before that, I had an archos recorder 20. With my archos, everything was setup with directories, just like a normal harddrive, and you just navigate to whatever directory, and play songs. Now that I've played with my ipod a little bit, I'm a bit confused how songs are recognizedand how the file system works. FYI, I'm using Itunes to import songs.

First, how does the ipod recognize what songs are on player, and where they are located? I know there are hidden folders where the mp3's are stored, but how does the ipod keep track of it? I tried just dragging and dropping songs into the hidden folders, but they don't show on the player.

Second, I'm messing with my ipod at work, and at home. I added a second album at work, and now, if I go home, copy the songs to my computer, and add the to my Itunes library at home, and then synch it with my ipod, what will happen?

2nd, I downloaded podutil, and ran it. Right now I just have 2 albums on it as I'm trying to figure out how to organize my music. and the results I get when I sort by artist are a folder labeled Third Day, with the whole album in there, and 5 folders labled J. Any idea why I got 5 folders labeled J? Also, how does ipodutil find the songs? Why didn't it find the songs that I dragged and dropped into the ipod? I'm guessing it searches for and recognizes songs the same way the ipod does.

I'm sure I'll have more questions....thanks for the help.

[SouthsideIrish]

1. The program you use to transfer the songs uses the information in the id3 tags to update a database that the iPod uses to find the songs. Depending on the program, the songs will usually be renamed and spread out evenly amongst all of those directories in the iPod_control directory. You can't simply drag and drop songs onto the iPod, you have to use a program like iTunes, otherwise the database will never be updated with the information taken from the tags and the iPod will never know that there are any songs there. Oh, and id3 tags are very important so take the time to get them right.

2. Yes, you can use another program like ephPod to take the work songs off of the iPod and transfer them your home computer and then import them to itunes. I'm not sure, but I believe that if you do an autosync iTunes will remove the songs that were uploaded at work and replace them with the songs you transfered at home.

3. I really think you need to start all over since you didn't know how the iPod worked. Podutil will look at the database as well, and use it to transfer the songs, so it has no idea that you tried to drag and drop those songs.

BTW you might want to take a look at some of the iPod 101 articles located here http://www.ipodlounge.com/articles.php and please post anymore questions that you have.

Bill

[Darrell]

For your first question: iTunes and iPod organizes music files by mainly using the tags, so it's a must to tag your files properly, especially the title, artist, album, and genre. Otherwise, you'll make a mess. It takes a little of getting used to, but IMHO, it's a better way of organization.

If you're using iTunes (I don't use any other music manager), simply add songs to the library, and sync.

For your second question: let me edit your steps:
Second, I'm messing with my ipod at work, and at home. [Before going to work, disable autosync (if you are using it) first.] I added a second album at work, and now, if I go home, copy the songs to my computer, and add the to my Itunes library at home, [then turn on autosync] and then synch it with my ipod, what will happen? ---> you'll have all songs currently in your iTunes library transferred to your iPod. Just make sure the files are properly tagged before syncing to avoid confusion on your part.

And for your 2nd second :D question: Sorry, I have podutility but I don't use it. iTunes is all I need.

Hope that helps... ;)

[SouthsideIrish]

iTunes? Blech! :D Much too minimalist for me.

Bill

[enjoilax]

ugh, dont trust Mr. Palatine above me. (Inver-side! WHUD UP!)

Anyways, definetely go iTunes. I dont trust Eph/Anapod

[SouthsideIrish]

How can anyone manage 12,000+ songs on iTunes? Blech! Can't be done. As I said much to minimalist for me, and BTW I use MediaCenter 10.

I've tried iTunes and it doesn't do any of the things I really need. But this is just me speaking. And why would anyone trust someone from the Windy City? They are just full of a lot of cold air. :D

Bill

[parvo99]

Hey, thanks for all your replies! I think I'm making more sense of this now :).

Now, does the database locate songs strictly by tags? If I were to go in and manually move a song from one folder to another, would it get lost, or will the ipod still see it? I don't know why I would ever do this, just curious how the database works.

I'm still not sure why ipodutil shows one of my artists under 5 folders. I did all the tags correctly for that album the first time. It is using korean font though. Maybe that's the problem. Also, in itunes, sometimes the font shows up correctly, and sometimes it doesn't. Anyone know why? Thanks again.

As for my "2nd" second, it was orginally my first second, and then I went back and decided to write about my second second, first. Then I forgot to edit my 2nd to a third. :-) Makes perfect sense now right???

[SouthsideIrish]

Ack! You really need to change your way of thinking. You need to realize that where the music is stored on the iPod is meaningless and you will give up that control to iTunes. Where the songs go is not important since you will be looking at them from either iTunes or the iPods menu. Remember, this is not a directory based mp3 player. Folders and directories don't matter anymore.

And this is coming from someone who is anal about how his songs are named, but I'm a special case.

Edit----

Do some of your songs have Korean tags? Most of my music is Japanese and some programs can't handle unicode. I'm not sure about podutil, but it may be having problems with the Han-gul.

Bill

[[sic]]

Now, does the database locate songs strictly by tags? If I were to go in and manually move a song from one folder to another, would it get lost, or will the ipod still see it? I don't know why I would ever do this, just curious how the database works.

No, it wouldn't work. The database actually has the paths to the songs, so iPod would still try to look in the old location. Think of the database like a book's index -- it gives the iPod the ability to find songs by artist, genre, playlist, etc. If you ripped a page out of the book (moved a song), and moved it to another chapter (folder) , your index (iPod) would be out of sync.

[nddl05]

tagging basically means all of your music is going to be messed up - mine sure was. you could try a program like id3tagit @ http://www.id3-tagit.de/. I had to spend a few hours putting tags on all my music, and frankly its a far inferior way of organizing my music. Everyone else says its the best thing since sliced bread, but it just doesn't fit my personal needs. You just have to make sure each song you have is tagged with the same artist - otherwise itunes will split it all up. good luck with everything, and be prepared to spend a lot of time tagging

[leertracy]

Tagging IS much better. And it IS a MAJOR pain.

But there are so many cool things you can do with the tags all filled in, especially for those of us with well over 40 gigs of music. I am excited by the way iTunes can create playlists by years, and am going to add original release year to all my tags. This will be a pain for compilation albums that have the year of the compilation as the year, but it will be worth it as far as the cool things I can do.

[ObiWanJak]

Interesting! Currently if I use iTunes to sync (for example) Eminem's Marshall Mathers LP, then it splits the songs into like 5 different files because he compiled songs with different artists (D-12, for example). If I understand what you're saying, I can use this Tagit site to change the ID3 tags and prevent this from happening? Is there a better way? Is this the best site out there? Thanks!

Loren

[SouthsideIrish]

To me id3-taggit is the best free tagger, but there are others. Like leertracy says there are so many cool things that you can do when your files are correctly tagged so take the time to do it right. Once you do, and you learn how to use iTunes, or MC10 a whole new way to listen to your music will be open to you.

I couldn't even imagine going back to a directory based mp3 player.

Bill McNair

[enjoilax]

I'm looking for it and i cant find it at all....

[zippy]

First of all, IMHO, the best way to tag your files is to rip them directly from CD in iTunes while connected to the Internet, that way iTunes will look up the ID3 tags on the Internet for you (there are sometimes errors, but they are few, and easily correctible). Once iTunes displays your CD with all its tags, you can edit them if needed before ripping to MP3/AAC. To do this, just click twice (but not a double click) on the tag you want to change, and type in your edit. For Eminem for instance, you can click on the Artist name twice slowly, then when it gives you the edit prompt, you can remove the references to D12, Nate Dogg, etc. If you don't do this, when you browse for artists on the iPod, it will show you Eminem, Eminem Feat. Nate Dogg, Eminem Feat. D12, etc.. If you forget to edit the tags before you rip them, it doesn't matter, you can edit them in the Library afterwards. Any changes here will automatically update on the iPod also.

If you don't have the CDs, then you will need to do this manually. Obvioulsy this will take lots of time if you have lots of music. I didn't have my music ripped before I got my iPod, so I haven't tried any 3rd party utilities to facilitate this.

As an aside, to others like me with dial up access. If you don't want to keep your line busy while you rip all your CDs, I discovered that you can open iTunes, and then insert your CDs one at a time. After it looks up the Tags for each CD, just eject it and insert the next CD until you are done. You can then close your Internet connection and go back and rip your CDs - you don't need to be connected anymore at this point, iTunes will remember the data for your CDs.

[leo95se]

silly question.. i have a lot of files that im not really sure how i should tag. are there tagging guidelines?
yes, im an engineer.. there are construction standards, why not tagging standards? :D

[zippy]

You can tag them however you want. Just remember that how you tag them is going to determine how they are organized on the iPod. Basically, I'd consider it a good idea to make sure the correct Artist, Album and Genre are there - those are the most common methods I use to browse for songs.