Has anyone tried the NEW Altec Lansing IM716 Earphones?

[gplonchak]

I have a pair of the Etymotic ER6i's and was wondering if these are any better. It claims to have "phenomenal bass" which I feel the ER6i's seem to lack a bit. Any thoughts?

[gplonchak]

Someone had to have tried these out....are they better than the ER6i's????

[gplonchak]

Anyone?

[tangfj]

I ordered these from Amazon for $119. I haven't gotten them yet but when I do I'll post my impressions. They seem like a good buy, esp at $119, so I thought it'd be worth a shot.

[gplonchak]

I also ordered them from Amazon for $119. I too will post my thoughts when I get them. Enjoy them when they come.

[tangfj]

When did you order them? I ordered my on 12/8 and they haven't even shipped to me so I sent an e-mail to amazon to see what's going on. Have yours even shipped yet?

[gplonchak]

I ordered them on 12/13 but did 2-day shipping so I should get them today. I will let you know how they are when I recieve them. (I'm very excited and anxious)

[J Dubbya K]

Me too...I ordered, but am yet to recieve them. From what I hear, these are based on the etymotic er4 series and PC magazine says they are fairly hard to drive with a weak amp (ipod), but I think I'll try them out and see how they are myself. I'm moving up from a pair of shure e3c's, so I hope the im716's don't dissapoint.

[gplonchak]

I got my pair yesterday and I'm pretty happy with these. They are way better than both the er6i's and the er4's. They have more bass overall without the inline bass boost turned on. With the bass boost turned on and the EQ turned off, they sound really good and full. If you have the Bass boost on with the EQ setting set to rock or something, it gets way to muddy and boomy which I'm not a fan of. Also, the inline volume is pretty cool. Now, you can just lower it or raise it by that and not have to do it by the iPod wheel. Small detail, but I like it. Overall. 4.5 out of 5. Let me know what you guys think when you get yours.

[J Dubbya K]

Just got mine too, but I'm thinking about returning them. I keep hearing a slight rattling in the right channel. Not too noticible, but still there. Otherwise, the phones sound great, clear and articulate with a nice bass boost, but I don't think they're too much of a step up from my e3c's. Has anyone tried the e4c's, how do they compare to the e3's or even the im7's for that matter?

[J Dubbya K]

by the way, for those of you that are thinking about getting the im7's, I got mine for 89.00 on amazon.com with the platinum visa promo. Just apply and get approved and you get 30.00 off any purchase.

[ZOOM ZOOM]

Hi JDK,
Iam using my E4c with 5G ipod straight out to the headphone jack and also use E3c. It,s(E4c)shows more details in highs than E3c and bass is more deeper and clear too. I think E4c are far superior than E3c. But in my opinion Ultimate ears Super-Fi 5Pro are better choice than these two Shure models. Because 5Pro soundstage is huge and bass is awesome. Also it,s shows very very good details in highs.

[gplonchak]

Hey J Dubbya K, what do you mean by "slight rattling in the right channel". Did it happen all the time or only once in a while?

[J Dubbya K]

Thanks for the advice on e4c and UE's, I looked into the superfi's and was impressed with the reviews...and to reply to the other guy...I believe I recieved a defective product, the rattling sounds like somethings loose in the driver, so I've decided to return.

[kexicao]

For those of you have received your IM716 more than two weeks, does it need to break-in? Does the sound quality get better after two weeks?

[etherealbeats]

These are not better then the ER-4's. They only have 90% of the accuracy of the ER-4P's, The ER-4P's have a much better soundstage. These are better then the ER6's but worse then the ER4's.

[etherealbeats]

Originally posted by kexicao
For those of you have received your IM716 more than two weeks, does it need to break-in? Does the sound quality get better after two weeks?

No, these contain the same balanced armature drivers as the ER-4's and they do not need breaking in.

[kexicao]

I really want to hear from the actual owers of IM716. After being using it for a while, how do you like it now? What is your experience?

[etherealbeats]

Everyone is a little confused about the relation between the Etymotics and the Altec's. So I have spoken to Don Wilson, he works for Etymotic, he is the project manager and his name is on many of the Etymotic patents. Anyway he tells me that the ER-4's and the ER6i's are not at all related to the IM716's and the IM616's and the only thing they have in common are the earpieces.

In his words:
"The only part the ER-4 and the Altec lansing IM716's and IM616's have in common is the white three flanged eartip. It is funny how these things grow out of proportion. I do need to set our sales staff straight on the difference between the ER-4 and the Altec Lansing product. Also the iM 716 bass boost just adjusts the bass without changing the sensitivity of the overall unit."

So if you have been told otherwise by Etymotic's sales staff, they are wrong.


I personally don't see the point in one but many people on the forums seem to find the need so I also asked him about the possibility of a dual driver version, heres what he had to say:

"There aren't any dual driver versions in our near future. The only reason for one would be to increase low frequency headroom. The real problem is the iPOD's low frequency roll off. With a good flat source you shouldn't have any low frequency output problems until its turned up too loud."

[J Dubbya K]

Tried em, didn't like them (mine had defects), so I returned them. The im716's sound really bright on hd mode and in bass mode it gets a slight boost in the low frequencies (still not enough for my taste). I got the superfi 5's and I'm lovin them...they're actually gettin more use than my e5c's!

[tangfj]

Alright, so I've had mine for a few weeks now and so far haven't found any defects... Just to let everyone know, I'm not audiophile by any means. So my review will really only be from a comfort level of the headphones and I'll be able to compare them to the other headphones I've tried/had.

COMFORT:
I think that these headphones sound very good and from a comfort level, I wear them all day at work and they remain as comfortable in my ears throughout the day. I used to have the shure e2c's (the lowest model) and these are by far more comfortable. I've also had a pair of AKG can earphones (the K26's if I remember correctly) and the im716's beat them out hands down in terms of comfort. I've also had a pair of the Sony MDR-EX70's and the im716's I think are right on par with the Sony's in terms of comfort.

SOUND QUALITY:
I think that these headphones sound very good to my untrained ears. They certainly sound much better than what's included with the ipod as well as some other headphones I've used. I can hear detail in almost all the music I listen to that before I couldn't hear like backup vocals, additional beats, etc... I use the bass boost all the time since I think it accentuates the bass a bit more and makes them sound better. When the phones are set to HD mode I think everything sounds a bit too bright for me.

Also, one thing everyone should know is that if you get these you'll have to have your volume on your ipod set to nearly 3/4. When I set it to any volume less than that it simply isn't loud enough. I think these headphones need a lot of power. That said I have my ipod plugged in almost all the time and I'm never that far from a place where I can plugin my ipod so it's not a big deal.

When comparing to other headphones I've used, I think that these sound much better than any of the other headphones I mentioned above.

Also, I'm very surprised to hear that these headphones do not share any of the same technology as Etymotic especially when Altec's website says explicity "InMotion earphones with Etymotic Research technology deliver a perfect combination of near-perfect sound reproduction and dead-quiet noise isolation.". Maybe they were just talking about the triple flanged tips though... :) All the reviews I read also said that these headphones shared a lot of the same technology, but maybe the reviewers were wrong??

CONCLUSION:
Anyway, all in all I think that these headphones are great. They come with everything I need... comfortable silicone sleeves for great in-ear sound, a good case, and extra tips. I know that some people have complained about the case because they would have preferred a zippered case, but I actually like the hard case that came with it. The case is very durable and I like the way that you can wind the cord around it so that the cord's not all tangled when you remove the headphones. I think I'm going to keep these for a while. Although, I might want to try out the super fi 5's since I've heard a lot of good things about them... I've heard that they aren't too comfortable though, which is important for me since I wear mine almost all day. For the meantime, though, I'm gonna hang onto these great headphones. Let me know if you guys have more questions.

[kexicao]

Thanks for the nice review!

The comfort is a major thing for me too. How is the microphonics problem some people were complaining about? Does it bother you? Also, do you need to used the tricks such as pulling up the right ear using your left hand over your head so that you can insert the earphone deeper?

Thanks again!

[tangfj]

I'm not sure what you mean about the microphonics problem, mainly because I don't know what microphonics are but my only real complaint about these is that you have to turn the volume up so loud on the ipod in order to make these headphones loud enough in your ear. As far as getting these deep enough into my ear, I don't do anything special... just put them in and push a little bit and that gets them deep enough into my ear.

[kexicao]

Micorphonic problem here refering to the cable rubbing noice being heard in the earphones.

[tangfj]

Ahhhhh, I see... I don't have too much of a problem with that. I don't even think it's noticeable. Of course I'm not jogging or anything with them so it's no big deal. Most of the time I'm sitting at my desk or walking. I do hear some noises when the cables are jarred heavily but it's not so bad that I wouldn't use the headphones. I don't think I've ever used any in-ear headphones, though, that don't suffer from the same problems. Here's to waiting for in-ear bluetooth headphones I guess!!

[kexicao]

Here is a very interesting quote from the forum on head-fi dot org where it has lot more posts on im716:

Quote:

Mr Wilson’s quote was, as you stated: "The only part the ER-4 and the Altec lansing IM716/IM616 have in common is the white three flanged eartip.”

The key to this potentially misleading, although factual, statement is how one defines the word “part”.

As alanz (post #91) mentions, the housing and wires are different. And “even if they have the same basic techniques to manufacture the transducer, they might have different mount point or shape to fit inside the housing, necessitating a new part that's not used in the ER4.” Thus the “part” is different.

Mr. Wilson’s statement was phrased to give the impression, as you noted: “they are not the same at all.” Your insightful statement here (above quote) and enoch’s follow-up (post #81) give reasons why seeding this impression on the web, that they are not the same at all, would be favorable to Ety. However, what actual changes there may be in the transducer or the electronics themselves relative to the ER4’s, as Aryolkary queries in post #85, I’m sure are proprietary.

In the end, Ety is a reputable company whose drivers are “made with great technology and tolerances” (enoch post #92). From the feedback in this thread the iM716 appears to have a very good, solid sound quality to price ratio.

And yes, we're all just “throwing out theories into the mix” and trying to garner a little more information. But we must all be just a little crazy, or passionate, about this hobby to spend so much time and energy over portable phones.

Unquote

[kexicao]

Any more actual user review?

[jSatch]

Originally posted by etherealbeats
These are not better then the ER-4's. They only have 90% of the accuracy of the ER-4P's, The ER-4P's have a much better soundstage. These are better then the ER6's but worse then the ER4's.

The iM716's have an accuracy score of 90%, the ER4S has an accuracy score of 92%, ER4P has an accuracy score of 86%, ER6 of 90% and ER6i of 81%. (please see Etymotics web site).

This is simply how 'accurately' the headphones reproduce the frequency response relative to the hypothetical optimal in ear response frequency curve generated by Etymotics.

"The ER-4P's have a much better soundstage. These are better than ER6's but worse than the ER4's"

Curious, was this determined from listening experience or derived from these scores?

[jSatch]

Originally posted by tangfj
Alright, so I've had mine for a few weeks now and so far haven't found any defects... Just to let everyone know, I'm not audiophile by any means. So my review will really only be from a comfort level of the headphones and I'll be able to compare them to the other headphones I've tried/had.


Thank you for your review.

All of the points you mention are valuable to those deciding whether to purchase these phones.

Cheers!

[jSatch]

Originally posted by kexicao
Here is a very interesting quote from the forum on head-fi dot org where it has lot more posts on im716:

Quote:

Mr Wilson’s quote was, as you stated: "The only part the ER-4 and the Altec lansing IM716/IM616 have in common is the white three flanged eartip.”

Unquote

Dear kexicao,

Firstly, thank you for your quote from my head-fi dot org post. It is certainly pertinent to what has transpired in this thread thus far.

I would just like to state, in defense of Mr. Wilson and Ety Res, there is a counterpoint to this story.

Both headwize dot com (see 11/20/05) and iLounge’s premier audio reviewer, Jeremy Horwitz, the latter at the Apple Expo, Paris, were told that the iM716 is “based on the technology of” or “a tweaked version of” the ER4, respectively. Or at least that is what they reported. The iLounge comment was associated with the Altec Lansing section of the Expo report. So it appears Altec, in my understanding, was promoting the ER-6i as the basis of the iM616 and the ER4 for the iM716. To my knowledge, this association is not directly stated in their public advertisements.

Mr. Wilson’s statement, which you have posted, appears to contradict the associations Altec is promoting with the Ety product line.

I am unaware that either company has released any further information regarding the specific similarities and differences between these products, that is, the AL iM716 and the Ety ER4. Depending on the contracts between these two companies, there is the prospect that doing so may involve legal technicalities.

This is knowledge based solely from posts on the web. I am not associated with either Altec or Ety, and I do not have access to inside information.

Both Old Dave and kwkarth, past and present owners of ER4’s, among other new iM716 users, are currently giving their impressions of the sound of these phones on head-fi dot org (search: im716).

I expect to be receiving the iM716’s later this week. Will keep you posted.

[kexicao]

jSatch, I am so looking forward to your review. Mean while, I hope amazon dot com will keep it's price of $120 until I have the chance to make up my mind.

[jSatch]

Originally posted by kexicao
jSatch, I am so looking forward to your review. Mean while, I hope amazon dot com will keep it's price of $120 until I have the chance to make up my mind.

Yes kexicao, I was worried about that too, the procrastinator that I am. But hey, the price may also go down.

J&R Music (jr dot com) also has it at $119, but it will cost you shipping as well ($6). I actually went with J&R as the Amazon free shipping had the potential to take longer (they state an additional 3-5 days for the free shipping option, if I remember), and the store reviews were marginally better for J&R. From what I've read, J&R also offers a 30-day return policy on most items (I didn’t notice an omission for headphones), and you can actually get someone on the phone. My item was shipped as stated, within 1-2 days this past (New Years) weekend.

I narrowed down my decision in the $100 range to the Westone UM-1, the Ety ER6i and the UE Super.fi 3. I was pricing the Ety’s when I noticed the head-fi thread on the iM716’s. Seemed better than the 6i’s (thanks Spiritboxer) without having to pony up double the price for the ER4P’s. Although from what I’ve read, it’s worth it for the ER4’s. To get close to the ER4’s sound at about the $100 level seemed a no-brainer. Well, we’ll see.

Best of luck!

[jSatch]

Originally posted by kexicao
jSatch, I am so looking forward to your review.

Thank you, but it may be awhile. I'm sorry, but I’ve got a lot on my plate the next few weeks. I’ll be lucky to listen to these very much at all. At least they’ll be burned in by the time I get to critically evaluate them.

Unfortunately, I have never owned IEM's before and have nothing decent to compare them to, only my over the ear Senn HD580 cans. Apples and oranges?

[kexicao]

With HD580, at least your standard will be high up there!

[jSatch]

My iM716 has finally arrived!

And now a long-winded first impression:

The volume/bass gizmo is really tiny. Thought it would be more obtrusive.

How painful is it supposed to be to get these flanged tips in? One ear OK, the other ughhh....... I hear microphonics. Guess it’s good to go.

The sound is extraordinarily detailed. Transient response is excellent. Vocals jump out. Nice. But it’s all a little light. Unbalanced would be kind.

Plugs OK? I hear myself swallowing though. The seal on the phone pops as I pull it out. Still, even with the bass boost it sounds like a lot of treble and a bass hump with a big void in the middle frequencies. With opera, you hear what is coming off the vocal cords of male vocalists, but miss the low mid fundamental that comes from the diaphragm, as if that makes any sense at all. Just picture Pavarotti at 125 pounds. Rock sounds tinny, distant, uninvolving. I hear fingers along the strings on acoustic guitar and vocalists breathing. Impressive, if the overall sound wasn’t so hollow and canned. Jazz and small scale classical seem the least affected. Large scale classical is congested.

The entry to my ear canals hurt from pushing these in as far as possible without them coming out of my nose. Maybe the wider shaft on this thing, vs the Ety (from kwkarth’s pics on head-fi dot org), is not letting me get it in far enough. Would saying these are my first IEMs be inappropriate here?

Put on the foamies- Whoooo baby, me likey! Difference is like night and day. Mid-bass is back. Everything is in balance. Vocalists don’t sound castrated, even female vocals are fuller, rounder and tantillizing. Transient response remains clean and fast but the sound signature is far less fatiguing. With the flanges I could hear myself swallow, I could hear the wind on the wires as I walk, but with the foamies I can hear myself blink.
Do ya think they pack the phones with the flanges just so the foamies sound so much better?

In time and much more listening I will find reservations with these phones. Even now, bass is still not in the same league as upper mids and treble, and there is an upper end roll-off. But Ety or Altec owners will not be saying, as I see on posts of other phones, I only wish the highs weren’t so rolled off. These get it pretty right on vocals too, due in large part to their quick transient response. But even with amplification they are still unquestionably on the light side of overall balance.

Other stuff:
Bass boost: I was seriously thinking of lopping this thing off. Maybe add a plug and jack so I can add it back when I feel wild and crazy, or drunk and foolish. But you know it’s a funny little thing. Makes some music muddy. OK, but not all music. On some it can sound pretty good. Can’t figure it out though. Some pop stuff, where one might expect an improvement, it gets really muddy. On light female vocals, where you’re really enjoying the detail and phrasing, it adds some depth. But not always. Goofy, but fun. After all, iPods are not by any stretch, high-end. They’re music candy. Have fun. I am surprised how much I can get out of this little 20gb brick, but it’s limitations are also becoming apparent.

Volume attenuator: Useless in line poop.

Power Hog, oink, oink: Yup, as per everyone else, these suck up the juice and take no prisoners. However, they get loud enough for me. Headbangers need not apply. In Europe DAPs are limited in their output. Don’t want anyone going deaf.

Amplification: Added a HeadRoom Supreme to the mix. Everything relaxes a little, fills out a tad more, blooms. Even so, they’re still light in the booty. But I wouldn’t trade that for their transient response and extension.

Comparisons: The only phones I have to compare are HD580s and a collection crappy earbuds for cycling and he gym. These will not replace the HD580s for home use. But I will be taking my iPod more places. OK, now I’m hooked. Sure wish I had a pair of ER4’s to compare……………….

Thanks for listening.

[tangfj]

Ok, so I said in a previous post that I was going to try out the ultimate ears super fi's and I finally did. I tried both the pro's and the eb's...

I found both of the phones to be remarkably good just as others have posted. The headphones are much louder than the im716's and both sound much fuller in sound. The eb's have a ton of bass and the pro's do not have as much but are much more detailed. For my musical tastes, I ended up choosing the eb's over all of them. The im716's I ended up giving to my gf because she's been using the stock headphones that came with her ipod mini.

Anyway, all I can say is that I should have spent the extra $$ and gotten these to begin with! They are awesome... everything down to the case that they came with were very well thought out. It even came with a line level attenuator (sp?) that regulates the sound to the phones. It has already come in very handy for my laptop, which for some reason had horrible sound that came out of it before (noise feedback, way too loud)... using the included attenuator has made a world of difference.

Anyway, on specific things I like about the eb's over the im716's:

- lot more bass, everything I listen to sounds much more full now... the im716's just didn't cut it in terms of bass levels
- I don't have to turn my ipod all the way up to hear anything anymore
- minor detail but the case is designed so much better than the im716's
- another minor detail but i like the cord length much more than the im716's... perfect for putting my ipod in my pocket. plus the cord on the eb's is replacable just in case anything should ever happen to it

Now although I did end up choosing the eb's over the im716. I still think that the im716's do have their own segment of the market. The im716's have very detailed sound and they are appropriatedly priced unlike the ultimate ears. Depending on your budget, I don't think you could go wrong with any of the high end headphones because no matter what they'll be way better than the stock headphones that came with the ipod. Anyway, if you guys have any questions about any of the headphones I tried let me know!!!

Oh just to let you guys know, I also tried out the Shure e3c's as well... (I actually tried the e3c's, the UE pro's, the eb's, and the im716's all at the same time with my brother... just returned the pro's and the e3c's to the apple store after trying them all out... they wouldn't let us try them out at the store but they did say we could return the ones I didn't like!) Anyway, the UE's IMHO were heads and shoulders above the e3c's and im716. The real big complaint about the im716's from both me and my brother were that you had to turn the volume up so high just to hear them... of course, if you're plugged in all the time it won't matter too much.

[shixun]

I've had the Altec Lansing iM716 for almost 3 1/2 weeks now, and I think it's an excellent earphone. Although the volume does need to be turned almost all the way up, the iM716 (in HD mode, using the triflanges) sounds great unamplified out of my nano, fuller and smoother than the Etymotic ER•6.

There is a definite learning curve involved in obtaining the proper fit and seal with the triflanges. Initially I had difficulty determining the correct angle of insertion of the earphone in my left ear (angled further upward than the right). Without an adequate seal on one side, half the bass was lost, and at times I was questioning whether the sound was any better than that of the stock iPod buds!

With a proper fit, the iM716 allows me to switch back and forth between it, the Sennheiser HD 555, Alessandro MS 1, and Koss KSC75 & SportaPro without feeling that any one of these headphones sounds dramatically better overall than any of the others. The iM716 is clearly brighter than the rest, but I may actually like it best. I find the sound quality of all of these 'phones "addictive" -- once I start listening, I don't want to stop. I'm able to simply enjoy the music without focusing on deficiencies in sound reproduction.

On the other hand, now I find the Koss Plug, Sony MDR-EX71SL, and, yes, even the Ety ER•6 relatively unlistenable:

Plug -- booming bass, rolled-off highs
EX71 -- boosted bass, sizzly highs
ER•6 -- thin, harsh
Adcom GFA-535 II --> Paradigm Mini Monitors (w/ rear ports ~1 1/2" from wall) -- bass outta control; just wrong!
Sony MDR-V6 -- boosted bass and highs (but not nearly as egregiously as the EX71!)

The EX71 and ER•6 improve notably with the Pocket Amp 2 - Version 2. However, the iM716 unamped still sounds fuller than nano --> SiK ram din --> PA2V2 --> ER•6.

[jSatch]

Originally posted by shixun
I've had the Altec Lansing iM716 for almost 3 1/2 weeks now, and I think it's an excellent earphone. Although the volume does need to be turned almost all the way up, the iM716 (in HD mode, using the triflanges) sounds great unamplified out of my nano, fuller and smoother than the Etymotic ER•6.

There is a definite learning curve involved in obtaining the proper fit and seal with the triflanges. Initially I had difficulty determining the correct angle of insertion of the earphone in my left ear (angled further upward than the right). Without an adequate seal on one side, half the bass was lost, and at times I was questioning whether the sound was any better than that of the stock iPod buds!

With a proper fit, the iM716 allows me to switch back and forth between it, the Sennheiser HD 555, Alessandro MS 1, and Koss KSC75 & SportaPro without feeling that any one of these headphones sounds dramatically better overall than any of the others. The iM716 is clearly brighter than the rest, but I may actually like it best. I find the sound quality of all of these 'phones "addictive" -- once I start listening, I don't want to stop. I'm able to simply enjoy the music without focusing on deficiencies in sound reproduction.

On the other hand, now I find the Koss Plug, Sony MDR-EX71SL, and, yes, even the Ety ER•6 relatively unlistenable:

Plug -- booming bass, rolled-off highs
EX71 -- boosted bass, sizzly highs
ER•6 -- thin, harsh
Adcom GFA-535 II --> Paradigm Mini Monitors (w/ rear ports ~1 1/2" from wall) -- bass outta control; just wrong!
Sony MDR-V6 -- boosted bass and highs (but not nearly as egregiously as the EX71!)

The EX71 and ER•6 improve notably with the Pocket Amp 2 - Version 2. However, the iM716 unamped still sounds fuller than nano --> SiK ram din --> PA2V2 --> ER•6.

Thank you for the nice review shixun, especially comparing the iM716s with the ER6s.

I was about to buy the ER6is until I noticed the iM716s on head-fi dot org. It was purported to be an Etymotic ER4S clone, bit there has been much debate on the Etymotic lineage of the iM176. Some even think it an ER6i in new clothing. Your direct comparison is in accord with others, and lays that argument to rest.

As per tangfj notes in his post, his personal preference is the full bass the Super-fi EBs are noted for. Just to add other opinions, there are many posts on head-fi dot org where people preferred the more detailed sound of the Ety ER4s or the iM716 (Old Dave) to the Super-fi 5 Pros, the latter being more detailed than the EBs. I myself prefer a fast transient response, especially when listening to vocals, but not at the expense of high freq glare. No phone is perfect; all of them have to deal with compromises. It’s all a matter of taste, as tangfj correctly points out.